On Tue, 04 Jan 2005 09:48:57 +0000, Albm&ctd wrote:
That wasn't such a crazy suggestion. I had an Audi '85 5000 STD (that's
turbo-diesel, not the other kind ;^) and there were a couple of times when
it wouldn't start. I heard a relay click, but nothing else. I found that a
solid thump with a straight tire iron at the solenoid bulge on the starter
motor would free up whatever was gummed up in there.

As I understand it: ignition key -> relay -> solenoid -> starter motor. In
other words the solenoid has a built in high current relay, a set of
contacts that are bridged when the solenoid "pulls in" to engage the
Bendix (if that is what it is properly called?) gear with the outside
teeth of the flywheel. The "solid tap" has worked for me a few times, on
that particular car (and ISTR an earlier odd-ball?).

--
Juhan Leemet
Logicognosis, Inc.

Juhan Leemet wrote:
Bendix type starters such as the Lucas M35 relied on inertia to pull the
starter gear down a spiral into the ring gear and had no solenoid on the
starter motor. If there's a solenoid on the starter then it's not a
Bendix starter.

"Juhan Leemet" <juhan (AT) logicognosis (DOT) com> wrote

Not at all, it can be an invaluable diagnostic tool. I was serious!

On Fri, 07 Jan 2005 09:38:21 +1100, Graham W wrote:

Ah, thanks for the correction!
Seems like a neat idea. Does anyone use a Bendix anymore?
I guess that means you still need a high current relay somewhere.

--
Juhan Leemet
Logicognosis, Inc.

On Fri, 7 Jan 2005 07:35:39 +0800, "Clockmeister" <no-one (AT) nowhere (DOT) com>
wrote:

Fonzie. I have never had to beat any starter motor to diagnose an
electrical problem.
I have seen people repeatedly beat their starter when the battery is
at fault. This is unkind to innocent starter motors and the person
doing the beating should be beaten with a frayed acid soaked battery
lead. This is similar to people who swear and beat their steering
wheel and go Wah..hhhaaahh..why me Lord.. I want my mummeee..sob
sniff.. when the car won't start. If this keeps up we may as well all
go back to living in trees and swinging on vines for transport,
beating our chests and screaming when something goes wrong..swing..
snap..thud..thump thump thump EEeeeeeaaAAaarrhhhaaaRRrhhhaAA.. cough
cough wheeze. Oh lookie, I found a banana.

Al

I don't take sides. It's more fun to insult everyone.
http://kwakakid.cjb.net/insult.html

Albm&ctd wrote:
So you are just a 'parts changer' then?

Keep throwing new parts at it and 'something' 'hopefully' has to fix it
before you go bankrupt eh?

A quick tap with a hammer on a starter can diagnose a stuck or worn out
brush and/or a bad solenoid according to what 'clicks' or what symptoms
change if any.

Mike
86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's

"Mike Romain" <romainm (AT) sympatico (DOT) ca> wrote

Damn right, it's a valuable diagnostic tool.

Clockmeister wrote:


--

Take Care (with the hammer)
Feral

On Sun, 9 Jan 2005 08:16:58 +0800, "Clockmeister" <no-one (AT) nowhere (DOT) com>
wrote:

Nope, I have a the correct tools, meters etc, therfore I have never
had to resort to violence ;-) Also hitting it is not a way to 'fix'
it. I fix a starter to a servicable condition with whatever parts it
needs after non-percussive diagnosis.
necessary. That's all I was on about :-)

Al

I don't take sides. It's more fun to insult everyone.
http://kwakakid.cjb.net/insult.html

Juhan Leemet wrote:
Like a lot of British engineering, it is a neat idea, but it needed the
Japanese to make it work right (or find a better way).

They were inclined to stick, and in the end a modern pre-engaged starter
is just a better answer.

Morris Minors had a starter switch which just pulled a plate across a
pair of contacts. No relay whatsoever. Early Minis had a similar device,
looked like a doorstop, beside the driver's seat, which pushed the plate
across contacts.