Conor wrote:
That's because you're too darned fussy. High mileage cars make a lot of
sense for older folk who cover lower mileages themselves.

But then it'd need to last 3-4 times as long. Which is not realistic, IME.

gazz wrote:
If they could go to a bit more I can reccomend a Puggy 206 SW. Mine is
great and quite a lot of room.

"Conor" <conor_turton (AT) hotmail (DOT) com> wrote

Why a diesel? For low mileage <5000/yr) a petrol has to be cheaper.

mark

"Willy Eckerslyke" <oss108no_spam (AT) bangor (DOT) ac.uk> wrote

Exactly. I've had a £200 Ford Sierra for the past 3 years and not a murmer
or trouble. Not even a tyre or wiper needed. It does under 5000 miles a year
mostly on motorways. Always passes MOT without anything need doing. Just
gets a oil change once a year. The Sierra I had before cost £300 and lasted
from 2001 till 2006. My next car will be the same sort of value, but verring
away from a Mondy as things like a new clutch or exhaust are far too
expensive compared to a Sierra. Wish I could still find a mint Sierra as far
better than the Mondy for my purposes IE, cheap and easy to repair.

"Conor" <conor_turton (AT) hotmail (DOT) com> wrote

3-4 k is not realistic to them tho, they are pensioners now, they've always
spent about a grand on a car, last one being the previa, it's worth two
thirds of feck all now as no one in their right mind would want a 2.8 litre
petrol engined car with petrol creeping back up to a quid a litre again,
they only bought it as they needed 6 rear seats and he wanted something big
so he can pretend to be a trucker again.

High mileage is no problem, hence the request for a diesel, 150k is sod all
on a diesel, a quick look on auto trader shows there's plenty of 306 estates
around the turn of the centaury era for a grand, with from 90 to 180k miles
depending on the cosmetics and toys.

They dont do many miles at the moment because it costs so much in fuel, I'd
imagine they'd do a couple more London trips a year with a more economical
car, and maybe the odd Sunday bimble, but we're prolly talking 4-5k miles a
year if that,
The mileage they did in previous years has all been to the schools and back
to collect brats for child minding, taking them home when their mother has
got a new boyfriend and spent the day fucking him on the sofa and forgot to
go and collect her kid etc.

Maintenance costs would be cheaper with a pug too, the previa is main dealer
for parts only it seems, the pug has GSF and euro car parts offering
realistically priced spares.

i never mentioned very reliable or low maintenance costs as you implied in
your last bitching session, just a diesel engine, mid sized possibly estate,
and do better than the 14 mpg they get from their current car.

So at the moment a pug 306 estate, or maybe the 406 is the thing to look
into, maybe the Citroen alternatives what ever they are, I'm thinking pre
common rail engine for simplicity, most running problems with them can be
fixed with a £100 pump re-calibration and a £60 injector set service, I've
got most of the engine locking tools and the dti with screw in adaptors to
time the pump back up, injector sockets etc. anyway.

On Wed, 08 Apr 2009 19:10:21 +0100, gazz
<gazz@kampen~getlostspammers~wagen.co.uk> wrote:


Much though I do like the diesel pugs, you're paying a lot extra for a
fairly pointless increase in fuel economy at that annual mileage and
that's before the increased servicing costs.

gazz wrote:
Have they considered a motorbike?

"Duncan Wood" <nntpnews (AT) dmx512 (DOT) co.uk> wrote


What are these increased service costs with a diesel that people mention??
i've never taken any vehicle i own to a dealer so i only know parts prices,
the new car i'm getting next week is a smart CDI, but it's exactly the same
cost at the dealer for the petrol versions service charge.

when i serviced the nissan micra, 1 litre injection petrol, i'd have to buy
:

an oil filter @ 6 quid, aftermarket make.
a gallon of oil @ 14 quid for GTX.
Air filter clean or replace @ 15 quid aftermarket.
Fuel filter @ 10 quid, again aftermarket.

And every 3rd service it's:
a set of plugs at about 20 quid for a decent brand.
rotor arm and dizzy cap about 20 quid,
change the coolant, a gallon of antifreeze at about 10 quid or so.

and a set of plug leads every 6 years or so at about 40 or 50 quid 'cos they
are specific to the make, i.e. cant use universal ones, and a set of belts
for the water pump and alternator drive (seperate belts on this car)

To service my iveco daily based motorhome, 2.8 litre TDI it's

an oil filter @ 7 quid, genuine iveco part, and it's 5 times the size of the
micras filter.
7.5 litres of oil @ 23 quid for 2 x gallon cans of GTD.
Air filter clean, i fitted a 40 quid K&N when i bought the van, otherwise
it's £35 for a paper filter from iveco every 3rd of 4th service, but it is
the size of a small dustbin, foot and a half tall by about 9 inches
diamiter)
Fuel filter @ 7 quid from Iveco.

Every 3 years i whip the injectors out and have them tested and adjusted for
free, or pay £10 per injector for new nozzles and having the pintle/needle
lapped.

Every 5 years i whip the injector pump off and get it re-calibrated for
about 100 quid including some seal replacement as needed.

Again, 3 yearly antifreeze change (obviousely i use more antifreeze as it's
an 11 litre cooling system before you take into account the calorifier loop
which holds another few litres), 5 yearly cam belt change (micra had a
chain)
Replace the drive belts when needed, cheaper than the micras as they are V
belts as opposed to serpentine belts,

Then the other service stuff which are not dependant on the engine type but
are usually checks.... brakes, brearings, suspension etc, and would cost the
same for replacement be it petrol or diesel engined.

ok i'm not comparing like for like vehicles, the iveco is a 4.5 tonner, and
uses very heavy duty parts, but ignoring size differances in service parts
resulting in price differances, the diesel is about the same if not a bit
cheaper to service in parts alone.


Someone had a little argument with me when i told them i was buying a smart
fortwo diesel a few days after the RHD versions were announced and you could
pre-order them,
He had just ordered a petrol version, and told me i was being conned, as
their car was cheaper than mine to buy, and would be cheaper to use as
petrol is cheaper so it'll cost me more the fill my tank.

the price differance for buying the diesel dosent matter to me (it's 800
quid btw), as i'm keeping the car a long time, and when i sell, it'll be
more sought after than the petrol models (LHD diesels fetch twice what RHD
petrols fetch)

and yes, it'll cost me 2 quid more to fill the tank with diesel than petrol
with the current 11p differance, but the petrols do about 43 mpg, the
diesels get about 85mpg, i can go almost twice the distance on a tank of
diesel than he can on petrol,

i also have no road tax to pay, can go into congestion/low emmision zones
for free,
he claimed i was making all that up, and parted saying 'at least i'll have
my car sooner than yours' as then the diesel waiting list was 3 months.

On Wed, 08 Apr 2009 20:33:29 +0100, gazz
<gazz@kampen~getlostspammers~wagen.co.uk> wrote:

Well on a 306 it's about the same cost, the oils slightly more expensive,
but it's every 12K instead of every 20K.

"Mark" <mark (AT) nospam (DOT) com> wrote


I take that back Gazz after reading your post about the 85mpg diesel smart.
I was just comparing the average 15-20 year old petrol or diesel as that is
all I have experience of. I've never owned anythng younger than 15 years old
in 35 years of motoring. BTW, I own a 20 year old diesel campervan (LT35)
and far rather work on that than anything modern. Like the sound of the
Iveco.

Mark