Missed opportunity for Ford??

#41

Quote:

Err no, well sorta. The TDDI as first used in the Focus was fords stab at
DI-ing the old endura DE engine (as per your Fester van) which to be
honest
was quite poor.

It wasn't the greatest, but a big improvement on the Endura-DE. One big
design improvement was making the water pump driven by the aux drivebelt
instead of the cambelt, enabling a much more reliable extended cambelt
interval (though I would never trust any engine with the same belt on for
100k!). Anyway, I've rattled on enough about how reasonably good the
Endura-DI is(!), so let's move this on.

Quote:

The 2litre duratec DI (115) engine in the new mondeo was
also designed in house by ford, and although slightly better was still
poor.

I thought the 115bhp and 130bhp diesels in the new mondeos were both TDCis.

Quote:

Ford then admitted defeat and sent the 2litre unit to PSA for development.
PSA redesigned the combustion chamber, and added their own Siemens common
rail system to make it into the CI, and sent it back to Ford.

Ford then had a good look at the 2litre unit, then took the 1.8 Endura DE
block and the TDDI head basically copied what PSA had done as far as head
work, and then added Bosch's common rail technology to it. Result is the
115
(and laterly the 100) engines.

Ah, so the 1.8TDCi doesn't have as much French design (more imitation of
French design) as the 1.4 and 2.0 engines then?

Quote:

The block is almost exactly the same as it always was and dates back to
the
original 1.6 unit. (they've only added a duplex chain and oil proof cover
to
drive the fuel pump instead of rubber belt.)

The 1,8TDCi is chain driven? Good stuff.

Quote:

Its still an 8 valve head and non cross flow design and rather dated. Its
also *all* iron contruction as was the original 1.6.

As in the old 1.6D engine in Mk2 Fiesta and Mk3 Escorts?

Peter

#42

AstraVanMan wrote:

Quote:

E320 CDi 204 hp, 0-60 in 7.9 and 145mph, isnt shabby, plus with a
chip I expect a lot of bhp n torque.

sorry thats the estate figures, 151mph and 7.5 secs, thats brilliant
for a heavy ass car like that.

Well my Audi doesn't quite come up to that, but it does have 140bhp,
quite a bit of torque, does 0-60 in 9.9 seconds and a top speed of
130mph. And if you sit at 60mph it'll do 60mpg. A recent tankful of
fuel, including about 70% at 3-figure motorway speeds, plus lots of
quick back-road hooning, returned an average of 40mpg.

Audi have the fastest diesel I think, 0-60 6.7, max 155 limited 275bhp/3750
478lbft/1800

http://www.fleetnewsnet.co.uk/roadte...rticleid=30172

#43

"Tim S Kemp" <news (AT) timkemp (DOT) karoo.co.uk> wrote

Quote:

AstraVanMan wrote:
E320 CDi 204 hp, 0-60 in 7.9 and 145mph, isnt shabby, plus with a
chip I expect a lot of bhp n torque.

sorry thats the estate figures, 151mph and 7.5 secs, thats brilliant
for a heavy ass car like that.

Well my Audi doesn't quite come up to that, but it does have 140bhp,
quite a bit of torque, does 0-60 in 9.9 seconds and a top speed of
130mph. And if you sit at 60mph it'll do 60mpg. A recent tankful of
fuel, including about 70% at 3-figure motorway speeds, plus lots of
quick back-road hooning, returned an average of 40mpg.

Audi have the fastest diesel I think, 0-60 6.7, max 155 limited
275bhp/3750
478lbft/1800

http://www.fleetnewsnet.co.uk/roadte...e=164&articlei

d=30172

Quote:

Doesnt the big Toureg thing have similar performance?

#44

Quote:

E320 CDi 204 hp, 0-60 in 7.9 and 145mph, isnt shabby, plus with a
chip I expect a lot of bhp n torque.

sorry thats the estate figures, 151mph and 7.5 secs, thats brilliant
for a heavy ass car like that.

Well my Audi doesn't quite come up to that, but it does have 140bhp,
quite a bit of torque, does 0-60 in 9.9 seconds and a top speed of
130mph. And if you sit at 60mph it'll do 60mpg. A recent tankful of
fuel, including about 70% at 3-figure motorway speeds, plus lots of
quick back-road hooning, returned an average of 40mpg.

Audi have the fastest diesel I think, 0-60 6.7, max 155 limited
275bhp/3750
478lbft/1800

http://www.fleetnewsnet.co.uk/roadte...e=164&articlei

d=30172

"Audi's new A8 4.0 V8 TDI quattro, a car that will make even the most
hardened petrol-head look at diesels in an entirely new light"

.......except, it would seem, Steve Firth, who reckons all diesel drivers
smell of wee-wee, LOL!!!

I was reading about that in Audi magazine a while back. Lovely bit of kit.
The W12 A8 must be bloody lovely, but probably uses around twice the fuel
the V8 TDI does, and most of the time there wouldn't be all that much at all
in how quick they feel.

Oh, and it mentions about V6 diesels being quite noisy - my 5-cylinder one
is a lot quieter than the V6 ones (as the owner of one of the ones I looked
at, who was upgrading to a V6 TDI). And did I mention it was the very first
TDI engine Audi ever made? I think I've got a future classic on my hands
here. No doubt you lot'll take the piss out of that :-)

Peter

#45

"Carl Gibbs" <cagmeister (AT) yahoo (DOT) co.uk> wrote

Quote:

"Tim S Kemp" <news (AT) timkemp (DOT) karoo.co.uk> wrote in message
news:hFOdnU6LX644IhPdSa8jmw (AT) karoo (DOT) co.uk...
AstraVanMan wrote:
E320 CDi 204 hp, 0-60 in 7.9 and 145mph, isnt shabby, plus with a
chip I expect a lot of bhp n torque.

sorry thats the estate figures, 151mph and 7.5 secs, thats brilliant
for a heavy ass car like that.

Well my Audi doesn't quite come up to that, but it does have 140bhp,
quite a bit of torque, does 0-60 in 9.9 seconds and a top speed of
130mph. And if you sit at 60mph it'll do 60mpg. A recent tankful of
fuel, including about 70% at 3-figure motorway speeds, plus lots of
quick back-road hooning, returned an average of 40mpg.

Audi have the fastest diesel I think, 0-60 6.7, max 155 limited
275bhp/3750
478lbft/1800

http://www.fleetnewsnet.co.uk/roadte...e=164&articlei
d=30172

Doesnt the big Toureg thing have similar performance?

No. Oddly enough neither does the phaeton with the tuareg V10. Heavier cars!

#46

Quote:

Cant believe i missed this thread! Having just done another road rally in a
205 diesel, i can say without a doubt that diesels are far far better than
the equivelent petrol engine. Mines not quite quick enough to keep up with
a GTi at the mo though, but as long as the insurance company dont moan too
much, it'll be getting closer by the end of the summer...
If you define sporty on how a car sounds, then you're no better than a
max-power-Nova-driving-turd-burgler. If a TDi engine can produce enough
power to make a car quick then why the hell not use it? As long as its
bolted to a decent chassis and decent suspension (ie not a Golf

) then it
can be sporty.

Just remember about the extra weight in the front, as i seem to have worn
out a set of pads in one night

Definately need those vented discs!!!

....great example - road rally is just like real road driving
conditions isn't it?

Engine noise was 1 example, and you're confusing the sound with noise
- nothing novaesque about a nice V6 or V5 warble.

So you're not disputing soot production? or lack of 'revvyness'? Both
these eat into the fun factor if you ask me, and a 'sporty' (whatever
that means) car is meant to be fun yes?

Vented discs wont reduce pad wear, you need proper brakes with
sensible sized discs and calipers for the application. I'm sure the
Pug 205 derv wasn't designed with blatting around a track in mind.

We agree on one thing, Golf MKIV suspension/chassis combo sucks

Anyway I digress, my original opinion stands - Sporty diesels, aren't.
Don't recall every saying diesels couldn't match on power alone.

A

#47

Tim S Kemp wrote:

Quote:

Nom wrote:
AstraVanMan wrote:
I think it would be fair to say that in the true real world (i.e.
everyday driving that does not involve a drag strip or thrashing
the tits off of the car), 150bhp of DERV will provide better
performance than 150bhp of PERV, due to the much higher torque
output.

What about comparing the torque curves of a 150bhp turbocharged
petrol engine with a 150bhp turbocharged diesel engine?

Would the difference really be all that much?

Nope.

Depends on the size of the motors... But for the same RPM I reckon the
diseasel will have higher torque (as it'll probably develop max power
at 4000 as opposed to 5500 for the petrol motor)

Agreed. However, that won't make it any quicker. It's the RATE of torque
that matters - ie, how many times it applies that torque, per second ... and
that's what power is

#48

MeatballTurbo wrote:

Quote:

In article <c6l41r0dlh (AT) news1 (DOT) newsguy.com>, Nom (AT) Somewhere (DOT) Somewhere
says...
Sporty cars ? The only properly sporty diesel I can think of, is the
180bhp Seat Leon Cupra - only available on the continent though.

Wasn't the best of the MKIV Golf GTis actually a GTTDi?
ISTR that it was the best performing, smoothest torquiest (not
including VR6/R32 varients, just the 4 pot GTi badged ones).

Nah, the best must be the 180bhp Turbo Petrol, surely.

#49

Steve Firth wrote:

Quote:

Never had a diesel leave even my truck for dead, let alone my car.

And how many decent Diesel engines have you encountered ? As I said in my
other post, the number of decent performance (ie, 200bhp+) Diesel engines
can be counted on your fingers !

Unless your truck/car make loony power, I find it very hard to beleive you
can keep up with the new BMW 330d !

Quote:

the mpg comment just proves the point that they are for elderly
cardigan wearers. BTW, you can have moderately fast (OK, slow)
diesels or one can have economical (OK very, very slow) diesels, but
one cannot have a diesel matching the performance of even quite a
modest petrol car and returning 50mpg.

What kind of ridiculous statement is that ?

You can have a 150bhp Golf, with either a Petrol or Diesel engine. The
Diesel will match the performance, and be a HEAP more economical.
You can have a 180bhp Audi A4, with either a Petrol or Diesel engine. The
Diesel will match the performance, and be a HEAP more economical.
You can soon have a 220bhp-ish 3-Series Beemer, with either a Petrol or
Diesel engine. The Diesel will match the performance, and be a HEAP more
economical.

For any given power figure, the Diesel WILL be more economical, and a nicer
drive to boot. Performance will be almost identical to the equivalently
powered Petrol car. The only flaw, is the higher purchase price of the
Diesel in the first place.

#50

Tim S Kemp wrote:

Quote:

That would be the smell of wee wee from pssing themselves laughing at
leaving all the petrol burners for dead, and still seeing over 50MPG
on the fuel computer then?

Even the Gold TD-GTI can't keep up with my lardy 180bhp volvo - so
leaving for dead?

Clearly that's because it has a 30bhp power defecit !!!!

The Audi A4 with the 180bhp diesel, will certainly be able to keep up with
your Volvo.

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Missed opportunity for Ford??

Cars Modifications Aspects of car modifications (tuning, styling) (uk.rec.cars.modifications)

Re: Missed opportunity for Ford?? - 04-27-2004 , 04:02 PM

Re: Missed opportunity for Ford?? - 04-27-2004 , 04:16 PM

Re: Missed opportunity for Ford?? - 04-27-2004 , 04:28 PM

Re: Missed opportunity for Ford?? - 04-27-2004 , 04:33 PM

Re: Missed opportunity for Ford?? - 04-27-2004 , 06:05 PM

Re: Missed opportunity for Ford?? - 04-28-2004 , 12:58 AM

Re: Missed opportunity for Ford?? - 04-28-2004 , 03:55 AM

Re: Missed opportunity for Ford?? - 04-28-2004 , 03:59 AM

Re: Missed opportunity for Ford?? - 04-28-2004 , 04:07 AM

Re: Missed opportunity for Ford?? - 04-28-2004 , 04:08 AM