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2005 Town and Country Steering Groan
Chrysler Dodge, Plymouth, Jeep, Eagle, etc info/talk (rec.autos.makers.chrysler)
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#11
 
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Re: 2005 Town and Country Steering Groan -
12-29-2006
, 12:13 PM
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maxpower wrote: Jimmy.A.Smith (AT) gmail (DOT) com> wrote in message news:1167345153.202303.242810 (AT) 79g2000cws (DOT) googlegroups.com... Hello All! Well I'm frustrated as hell. I've taken my wife's van to the Cracksler (I call them that, beceause the answers they are giving me are like they are on crack) dealership at least 3 times for this issue and all I get is: "yes its a problem that Chrysler knows about and they are working on a fix". When my wife turns into say the driveway or a parking spot, there is a noticable groan coming from the front end. It only happens when she's driving slow and turning, Never at freeway speeds and never when driving straight. I keep getting the same line, so I figured I would give this a shot to see if anyone else has this issue. She has a 05 Town and Country with a 3.6L engine. You are frustrated? So am I!!! when ever the weather gets colder this moan/shudder/groan/ low speed parking lot maneuvers from the steering returns on these vehicles and as your "Chrysler" dealer tells you...they are trying to get the problem fixed, since 2004!!! Don't blame the technicians or the dealer. We can not engineer parts to eliminate this problem. There has been 4 TSB's out to correct this problem and so far none have worked. The last time I called Chrysler on this they tell me some off the wall story too. If you want to complain to someone, contact the toll free number on back of your owners manual. By the way, Chrysler doesn't offer a 3.6L it is a 3.8/3.3L Glenn Beasley Chrysler Tech Glenn, Thanks for giving me some insight on this. It's driving us nuts! So 4 tsb's? Would I be able to get those #'s? I would really be intrested in reading them. Plus it would give me some ammo with my wife as to why she needs to get a different van. LOL. You are correct, its a 3.8L. Thanks for that correction. I'm not blaming the techs or the dealer, just Cracksler! They invested soo much money in the stow n go, they forgot about the rest of the vehicle. The first thing the dealer should have done was flush the fluid, If the |
installed, Part# 4743473AE. If the problem still persists a new power
steering rack would have been replaced.
Glenn
#12
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maxpower wrote: Jimmy.A.Smith (AT) gmail (DOT) com> wrote in message news:1167345153.202303.242810 (AT) 79g2000cws (DOT) googlegroups.com... Hello All! Well I'm frustrated as hell. I've taken my wife's van to the Cracksler (I call them that, beceause the answers they are giving me are like they are on crack) dealership at least 3 times for this issue and all I get is: "yes its a problem that Chrysler knows about and they are working on a fix". When my wife turns into say the driveway or a parking spot, there is a noticable groan coming from the front end. It only happens when she's driving slow and turning, Never at freeway speeds and never when driving straight. I keep getting the same line, so I figured I would give this a shot to see if anyone else has this issue. She has a 05 Town and Country with a 3.6L engine. You are frustrated? So am I!!! when ever the weather gets colder this moan/shudder/groan/ low speed parking lot maneuvers from the steering returns on these vehicles and as your "Chrysler" dealer tells you...they are trying to get the problem fixed, since 2004!!! Don't blame the technicians or the dealer. We can not engineer parts to eliminate this problem. There has been 4 TSB's out to correct this problem and so far none have worked. The last time I called Chrysler on this they tell me some off the wall story too. If you want to complain to someone, contact the toll free number on back of your owners manual. By the way, Chrysler doesn't offer a 3.6L it is a 3.8/3.3L Glenn Beasley Chrysler Tech Glenn, Thanks for giving me some insight on this. It's driving us nuts! So 4 tsb's? Would I be able to get those #'s? I would really be intrested in reading them. Plus it would give me some ammo with my wife as to why she needs to get a different van. LOL. You are correct, its a 3.8L. Thanks for that correction. I'm not blaming the techs or the dealer, just Cracksler! They invested soo much money in the stow n go, they forgot about the rest of the vehicle. |
problem is still evident a new P/S cooler package should have been
installed, Part# 4743473AE. If the problem still persists a new power
steering rack would have been replaced.
Glenn
#13
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jdoe wrote: My 03 does it too. I really don't care. Geez some are just too touchy about nothing. "maxpower" <damnnickname (AT) yahoo (DOT) com> wrote in message news:VoWdnTdaDd2DwQnYnZ2dnUVZ_qWvnZ2d (AT) comcast (DOT) com... JDOE, It's ok that you don't care that your van groans, I just don't believe that if you pay $30,000 for something that you should have to put up with inferior workmanship. It is something to be "touchy" about. It's an issue that's annoying as HELL. |
the problem is but they don't want to fix it. I am betting the simple
problem
is that the pully on the PS is too small and the pump isn't developing
sufficient
pressure at low speed - as a result your getting a resonance. Ever
heard a water hammer in a water pipe, or groaning in a old radiator
steam pipe? Same thing. Cold weather amplifies it since the fluid is
colder
and thicker and has more resistance. A flush probably will fix it
temporairly
since the fluid will be newer and lower friction but it won't last.
As to why they won't fix it that's easy. A larger pully means the pump
will waste slightly more energy, thus lower EPA ratings. Or there may
be engine bay or engine layout interference issues. In other words, to
fix the problem means they have to make a tradeoff elsewhere. A tradeoff
they don't want to make. Since the problem is harmless, they are just
making up bullcrap to tell the public since they don't want to fix it.
Your best bet is to keep screaming about it on the 800 line but most
likely those calls will go into the same file that Microsoft uses for the
people that call in and bitch that their new Windows version is so much
piggier and hoggy than the old one they cant run it on their old hardware.
In other words, yah they know there's a problem, yah they know how to
fix it, (spend money optimizing the code) Na they don't want to make the
tradeoff to actually fix it.
Ted
#14
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You can request from the dealer to get you any TSB's that may pertain to your problem. The first thing that should have been done was to have the Power steering fluid flushed. Was that done? Glenn |
#15
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"97CamryLEnewbie" <Jimmy.A.Smith (AT) gmail (DOT) com> wrote in message news:1167409137.968261.21430 (AT) h40g2000cwb (DOT) googlegroups.com... jdoe wrote: My 03 does it too. I really don't care. Geez some are just too touchy about nothing. "maxpower" <damnnickname (AT) yahoo (DOT) com> wrote in message news:VoWdnTdaDd2DwQnYnZ2dnUVZ_qWvnZ2d (AT) comcast (DOT) com... JDOE, It's ok that you don't care that your van groans, I just don't believe that if you pay $30,000 for something that you should have to put up with inferior workmanship. It is something to be "touchy" about. It's an issue that's annoying as HELL. Here is my $0.02 on this one. I bet the engineers know full well what the problem is but they don't want to fix it. I am betting the simple problem is that the pully on the PS is too small and the pump isn't developing sufficient pressure at low speed - as a result your getting a resonance. Ever heard a water hammer in a water pipe, or groaning in a old radiator steam pipe? Same thing. Cold weather amplifies it since the fluid is colder and thicker and has more resistance. A flush probably will fix it temporairly since the fluid will be newer and lower friction but it won't last. As to why they won't fix it that's easy. A larger pully means the pump will waste slightly more energy, thus lower EPA ratings. Or there may be engine bay or engine layout interference issues. In other words, to fix the problem means they have to make a tradeoff elsewhere. A tradeoff they don't want to make. Since the problem is harmless, they are just making up bullcrap to tell the public since they don't want to fix it. Your best bet is to keep screaming about it on the 800 line but most likely those calls will go into the same file that Microsoft uses for the people that call in and bitch that their new Windows version is so much piggier and hoggy than the old one they cant run it on their old hardware. In other words, yah they know there's a problem, yah they know how to fix it, (spend money optimizing the code) Na they don't want to make the tradeoff to actually fix it. Ted |
#16
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Nice work Einstein. First of all, a larger pulley would slow the pump down. Probably not good if you want to increase pressure. Also, I'm sure they wouldn't be spending what it takes to replace steering racks when a simple pulley replacement would actually fix it. On Sat, 30 Dec 2006 02:28:22 -0800, "Ted Mittelstaedt" tedm (AT) toybox (DOT) placo.com> wrote: "97CamryLEnewbie" <Jimmy.A.Smith (AT) gmail (DOT) com> wrote in message news:1167409137.968261.21430 (AT) h40g2000cwb (DOT) googlegroups.com... jdoe wrote: My 03 does it too. I really don't care. Geez some are just too touchy about nothing. "maxpower" <damnnickname (AT) yahoo (DOT) com> wrote in message news:VoWdnTdaDd2DwQnYnZ2dnUVZ_qWvnZ2d (AT) comcast (DOT) com... JDOE, It's ok that you don't care that your van groans, I just don't believe that if you pay $30,000 for something that you should have to put up with inferior workmanship. It is something to be "touchy" about. It's an issue that's annoying as HELL. Here is my $0.02 on this one. I bet the engineers know full well what the problem is but they don't want to fix it. I am betting the simple problem is that the pully on the PS is too small and the pump isn't developing sufficient pressure at low speed - as a result your getting a resonance. Ever heard a water hammer in a water pipe, or groaning in a old radiator steam pipe? Same thing. Cold weather amplifies it since the fluid is colder and thicker and has more resistance. A flush probably will fix it temporairly since the fluid will be newer and lower friction but it won't last. As to why they won't fix it that's easy. A larger pully means the pump will waste slightly more energy, thus lower EPA ratings. Or there may be engine bay or engine layout interference issues. In other words, to fix the problem means they have to make a tradeoff elsewhere. A tradeoff they don't want to make. Since the problem is harmless, they are just making up bullcrap to tell the public since they don't want to fix it. Your best bet is to keep screaming about it on the 800 line but most likely those calls will go into the same file that Microsoft uses for the people that call in and bitch that their new Windows version is so much piggier and hoggy than the old one they cant run it on their old hardware. In other words, yah they know there's a problem, yah they know how to fix it, (spend money optimizing the code) Na they don't want to make the tradeoff to actually fix it. Ted |
#17
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actually d.c requires each dealer to a have a power steering pressure analyzer tool on hand as a essential tool( required )but the dealer techs do not use it let alone know what it looks like and it will tell the tech whats wrong without a fluid flush it can be a pain to hook up and most flatrate techs won't take the time to do so, even thought there is a labor time for it damnnickname wrote: You can request from the dealer to get you any TSB's that may pertain to your problem. The first thing that should have been done was to have the Power steering fluid flushed. Was that done? Glenn |
big bold letters it says do not replace power steering pump for these
problems!!!. It isn't a power steering pump or pressure problem, no need to
connect a gauge either!! You sell all the pumps you want to your customers.
But what you are really doing is flushing the system and charging them for a
pump and the labor to install it.
Just a thought Pal
Glenn
#18
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Nice work Einstein. First of all, a larger pulley would slow the pump down. Probably not good if you want to increase pressure. Also, I'm sure they wouldn't be spending what it takes to replace steering racks when a simple pulley replacement would actually fix it. On Sat, 30 Dec 2006 02:28:22 -0800, "Ted Mittelstaedt" tedm (AT) toybox (DOT) placo.com> wrote: "97CamryLEnewbie" <Jimmy.A.Smith (AT) gmail (DOT) com> wrote in message news:1167409137.968261.21430 (AT) h40g2000cwb (DOT) googlegroups.com... jdoe wrote: My 03 does it too. I really don't care. Geez some are just too touchy about nothing. "maxpower" <damnnickname (AT) yahoo (DOT) com> wrote in message news:VoWdnTdaDd2DwQnYnZ2dnUVZ_qWvnZ2d (AT) comcast (DOT) com... JDOE, It's ok that you don't care that your van groans, I just don't believe that if you pay $30,000 for something that you should have to put up with inferior workmanship. It is something to be "touchy" about. It's an issue that's annoying as HELL. Here is my $0.02 on this one. I bet the engineers know full well what the problem is but they don't want to fix it. I am betting the simple problem is that the pully on the PS is too small and the pump isn't developing sufficient pressure at low speed - as a result your getting a resonance. Ever heard a water hammer in a water pipe, or groaning in a old radiator steam pipe? Same thing. Cold weather amplifies it since the fluid is colder and thicker and has more resistance. A flush probably will fix it temporairly since the fluid will be newer and lower friction but it won't last. As to why they won't fix it that's easy. A larger pully means the pump will waste slightly more energy, thus lower EPA ratings. Or there may be engine bay or engine layout interference issues. In other words, to fix the problem means they have to make a tradeoff elsewhere. A tradeoff they don't want to make. Since the problem is harmless, they are just making up bullcrap to tell the public since they don't want to fix it. Your best bet is to keep screaming about it on the 800 line but most likely those calls will go into the same file that Microsoft uses for the people that call in and bitch that their new Windows version is so much piggier and hoggy than the old one they cant run it on their old hardware. In other words, yah they know there's a problem, yah they know how to fix it, (spend money optimizing the code) Na they don't want to make the tradeoff to actually fix it. Ted |
#19
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Nice work Einstein. First of all, a larger pulley would slow the pump down. Probably not good if you want to increase pressure. |
the server right away so I forgot to post a followup. Smaller pully is
what you want. But of course all the parasitic loss issues still apply. To
make the pump turn faster at low engine speeds means you are going to
sap more horsepower from the engine.
Quote:
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Also, I'm sure they wouldn't be spending what it takes to replace steering racks when a simple pulley replacement would actually fix it. |
deliberately playing dumb. Manufactures are under enormous constraints
to meet fuel economy figures that are mandated by the government.
Chrysler might have many tradeoffs to make if they decrease EPA mileage
on the vehicle by even 1 mpg.
Ted
#20
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"bllsht" <nospam (AT) dot (DOT) net> wrote in message news:65jdp2lreag88f6qcs74jcs5sjce1t5jbb (AT) 4ax (DOT) com... Nice work Einstein. First of all, a larger pulley would slow the pump down. Probably not good if you want to increase pressure. Yeah, I realized that the second I sent that, but the post didn't appear on the server right away so I forgot to post a followup. Smaller pully is what you want. But of course all the parasitic loss issues still apply. To make the pump turn faster at low engine speeds means you are going to sap more horsepower from the engine. Also, I'm sure they wouldn't be spending what it takes to replace steering racks when a simple pulley replacement would actually fix it. You simply don't understand either because you are an idiot or are deliberately playing dumb. Manufactures are under enormous constraints to meet fuel economy figures that are mandated by the government. Chrysler might have many tradeoffs to make if they decrease EPA mileage on the vehicle by even 1 mpg. Ted |
system. People all the time put "underdrive pulleys" on the main crank
to slow down all accessories without too much problem (though under
worst-case driving conditions, there may be some noticeable sacrifices -
battery droop if a lot of idle time, a.c. performance not optimum in
stop and go, etc.). The factory has to design for worst-case conditions.
Bill Putney
(To reply by e-mail, replace the last letter of the alphabet in my
address with the letter 'x')
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