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  #1  
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Matt Ion
 
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Default Civic hesitation problem... - 05-11-2007 , 01:32 PM






Buddy of mine just rebuilt (with all OEM parts!) a D16A6 with PGM-FI for
his '89 Civic (including the appropriate computer and wiring harness).
Got it installed, turned the key, engine turned 3 times... and fired
right up. Very nice. Idles smoooooth and quiet...

But when he gives it any gas, even just sitting in neutral, it bogs and
hesitates. Hit the gas too fast, and it just sputters and dies. Do it
carefully, and once it gets 1800rpm or so, it works fine. It also seems
to idle a little bit rich.

Thoughts? Ideas? He's checked for error codes, but it's not giving any.

TIA

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  #2  
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Matt Ion
 
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Default Re: Civic hesitation problem... - 05-11-2007 , 01:34 PM






Matt Ion wrote:
Quote:
Buddy of mine just rebuilt (with all OEM parts!) a D16A6 with PGM-FI for
his '89 Civic (including the appropriate computer and wiring harness).
Got it installed, turned the key, engine turned 3 times... and fired
right up. Very nice. Idles smoooooth and quiet...

But when he gives it any gas, even just sitting in neutral, it bogs and
hesitates. Hit the gas too fast, and it just sputters and dies. Do it
carefully, and once it gets 1800rpm or so, it works fine. It also seems
to idle a little bit rich.

Thoughts? Ideas? He's checked for error codes, but it's not giving any.

TIA
BTW, it looks real nice, he's done a lot of work cleaning up the body,
detailing the interior, and cleaned and repainted all the engine parts.
http://www2.moltenimage.com/civic/


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  #3  
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Jim Yanik
 
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Default Re: Civic hesitation problem... - 05-11-2007 , 04:35 PM



Matt Ion <soundy106 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> wrote in
news:NE21i.173204$DE1.115546@pd7urf2no:

Quote:
Buddy of mine just rebuilt (with all OEM parts!) a D16A6 with PGM-FI for
his '89 Civic (including the appropriate computer and wiring harness).
Got it installed, turned the key, engine turned 3 times... and fired
right up. Very nice. Idles smoooooth and quiet...

But when he gives it any gas, even just sitting in neutral, it bogs and
hesitates. Hit the gas too fast, and it just sputters and dies. Do it
carefully, and once it gets 1800rpm or so, it works fine. It also seems
to idle a little bit rich.

Thoughts? Ideas? He's checked for error codes, but it's not giving any.

TIA
Does he have enough fuel pressure to run the fuel injection?
That takes more pressure than a carbureted engine,and the fuel pump may be
different for a carbureted model.

--
Jim Yanik
jyanik
at
kua.net


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  #4  
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Matt Ion
 
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Default Re: Civic hesitation problem... - 05-11-2007 , 05:18 PM



Jim Yanik wrote:
Quote:
Matt Ion <soundy106 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> wrote in
news:NE21i.173204$DE1.115546@pd7urf2no:

Buddy of mine just rebuilt (with all OEM parts!) a D16A6 with PGM-FI for
his '89 Civic (including the appropriate computer and wiring harness).
Got it installed, turned the key, engine turned 3 times... and fired
right up. Very nice. Idles smoooooth and quiet...

But when he gives it any gas, even just sitting in neutral, it bogs and
hesitates. Hit the gas too fast, and it just sputters and dies. Do it
carefully, and once it gets 1800rpm or so, it works fine. It also seems
to idle a little bit rich.

Thoughts? Ideas? He's checked for error codes, but it's not giving any.

TIA

Does he have enough fuel pressure to run the fuel injection?
That takes more pressure than a carbureted engine,and the fuel pump may be
different for a carbureted model.
The old engine was a D15, if memory serves, but it definitely had
PGM-FI. It runs great past 2000rpm and on up to redline, it's just that
initial low-RPM push that's dropping out.


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  #5  
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Jim Yanik
 
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Default Re: Civic hesitation problem... - 05-11-2007 , 06:28 PM



Matt Ion <soundy106 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> wrote in
news:_Y51i.176043$6m4.108395@pd7urf1no:

Quote:
Jim Yanik wrote:
Matt Ion <soundy106 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> wrote in
news:NE21i.173204$DE1.115546@pd7urf2no:

Buddy of mine just rebuilt (with all OEM parts!) a D16A6 with PGM-FI
for his '89 Civic (including the appropriate computer and wiring
harness). Got it installed, turned the key, engine turned 3 times...
and fired right up. Very nice. Idles smoooooth and quiet...

But when he gives it any gas, even just sitting in neutral, it bogs
and hesitates. Hit the gas too fast, and it just sputters and dies.
Do it carefully, and once it gets 1800rpm or so, it works fine. It
also seems to idle a little bit rich.

Thoughts? Ideas? He's checked for error codes, but it's not giving
any.

TIA

Does he have enough fuel pressure to run the fuel injection?
That takes more pressure than a carbureted engine,and the fuel pump
may be different for a carbureted model.

The old engine was a D15, if memory serves, but it definitely had
PGM-FI. It runs great past 2000rpm and on up to redline, it's just
that initial low-RPM push that's dropping out.
maybe a bad throttle position sensor?
Maybe it's defective at the low end,perhaps a dirty/worn resistive element.

--
Jim Yanik
jyanik
at
kua.net


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  #6  
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JHLorusso@gmail.com
 
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Default Re: Civic hesitation problem... - 05-11-2007 , 08:25 PM








it sounds like you converted from DPFI to MPFI, in which case a bit
of wiring was involved

simple run down to check your wiring against

ECU pin component
a1 inj 1
a3 inj 2
a5 inj 3
a7 inj 4
a15 inj resistor box


run all red/blk wires from injectors back to resistor box
swap pins from c1 and c2 to b10 and b12 respectively
run new wire from c1 and c2 into engine bay
swap out old DPFI distributor plug to MPFI plug (matching colors)
wire from c1 goes to blue/grn wire on new distributor plug
wire from c2 goes to yell/grn wire on new distributor plug
extend TPS plug 6" and swap outer 2 wires




sounds like you forgot to switch the TPS wires


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  #7  
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Matt Ion
 
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Default Re: Civic hesitation problem... - 05-11-2007 , 09:32 PM



Jim Yanik wrote:
Quote:
Matt Ion <soundy106 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> wrote in
news:_Y51i.176043$6m4.108395@pd7urf1no:

Jim Yanik wrote:
Matt Ion <soundy106 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> wrote in
news:NE21i.173204$DE1.115546@pd7urf2no:

Buddy of mine just rebuilt (with all OEM parts!) a D16A6 with PGM-FI
for his '89 Civic (including the appropriate computer and wiring
harness). Got it installed, turned the key, engine turned 3 times...
and fired right up. Very nice. Idles smoooooth and quiet...

But when he gives it any gas, even just sitting in neutral, it bogs
and hesitates. Hit the gas too fast, and it just sputters and dies.
Do it carefully, and once it gets 1800rpm or so, it works fine. It
also seems to idle a little bit rich.

Thoughts? Ideas? He's checked for error codes, but it's not giving
any.

TIA
Does he have enough fuel pressure to run the fuel injection?
That takes more pressure than a carbureted engine,and the fuel pump
may be different for a carbureted model.
The old engine was a D15, if memory serves, but it definitely had
PGM-FI. It runs great past 2000rpm and on up to redline, it's just
that initial low-RPM push that's dropping out.

maybe a bad throttle position sensor?
Maybe it's defective at the low end,perhaps a dirty/worn resistive element.
I thought of that... we haven't had a chance to check it yet, but I'll
pass that on the suggestion. But wouldn't the computer be throwing
error codes in that case?

Fortunately he still has the old engine, complete with intake, so
there's at least a known working one there


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  #8  
Old   
Matt Ion
 
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Default Re: Civic hesitation problem... - 05-11-2007 , 09:37 PM



JHLorusso (AT) gmail (DOT) com wrote:
Quote:



it sounds like you converted from DPFI to MPFI, in which case a bit
of wiring was involved

simple run down to check your wiring against

ECU pin component
a1 inj 1
a3 inj 2
a5 inj 3
a7 inj 4
a15 inj resistor box


run all red/blk wires from injectors back to resistor box
swap pins from c1 and c2 to b10 and b12 respectively
run new wire from c1 and c2 into engine bay
swap out old DPFI distributor plug to MPFI plug (matching colors)
wire from c1 goes to blue/grn wire on new distributor plug
wire from c2 goes to yell/grn wire on new distributor plug
extend TPS plug 6" and swap outer 2 wires




sounds like you forgot to switch the TPS wires
Both engines (the one that came out of the car, and the new one) have
the same intake systems, the "PGM-FI PROGRAMMED FUEL INJECTION" throttle
bodies and multipoint injectors. I'll tell him to double-check the
wiring, but I don't think that'll be it.


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  #9  
Old   
Dave and Trudy
 
Posts: n/a

Default Re: Civic hesitation problem... - 05-12-2007 , 12:18 AM




"Matt Ion" <soundy106 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> wrote

Quote:
Buddy of mine just rebuilt (with all OEM parts!) a D16A6 with PGM-FI for
his '89 Civic (including the appropriate computer and wiring harness). Got
it installed, turned the key, engine turned 3 times... and fired right up.
Very nice. Idles smoooooth and quiet...

But when he gives it any gas, even just sitting in neutral, it bogs and
hesitates. Hit the gas too fast, and it just sputters and dies. Do it
carefully, and once it gets 1800rpm or so, it works fine. It also seems
to idle a little bit rich.

Thoughts? Ideas? He's checked for error codes, but it's not giving any.

TIA
Just a thought...Some of these systems take a bit of time for the various
processors to synch and get a baseline established. I don't know about the
Honda Civic but I do know that the Chrysler takes a day or so to get
completely normal.

DaveD




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  #10  
Old   
Matt Ion
 
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Default Re: Civic hesitation problem... - 05-12-2007 , 02:13 AM



jim beam wrote:
Quote:
Matt Ion wrote:
JHLorusso (AT) gmail (DOT) com wrote:




it sounds like you converted from DPFI to MPFI, in which case a bit
of wiring was involved

simple run down to check your wiring against

ECU pin component
a1 inj 1
a3 inj 2
a5 inj 3
a7 inj 4
a15 inj resistor box


run all red/blk wires from injectors back to resistor box
swap pins from c1 and c2 to b10 and b12 respectively
run new wire from c1 and c2 into engine bay
swap out old DPFI distributor plug to MPFI plug (matching colors)
wire from c1 goes to blue/grn wire on new distributor plug
wire from c2 goes to yell/grn wire on new distributor plug
extend TPS plug 6" and swap outer 2 wires




sounds like you forgot to switch the TPS wires

Both engines (the one that came out of the car, and the new one) have
the same intake systems, the "PGM-FI PROGRAMMED FUEL INJECTION"
throttle bodies and multipoint injectors. I'll tell him to
double-check the wiring, but I don't think that'll be it.

it's likely that it is - the tps sensor rotation is opposite on the 2pfi
to the 4pfi. the plug and sensors are the same but the wires are
reversed as a result.
Except that both the previous engine and the new engine are both MPFI
with identical throttle bodies...



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