Ben Blaney wrote:

I was going to ask about operations, but you know, with Conor wanting to
continue his dick-waving exercise on usenet and RL, I'd better not ask
for any more information - just in case he does drop by with an Eaton
equipped tractor unit to see how quickly I can figure it out.

I'd imagine it does. Most people can barely manage a car shift - my
dad's driving horrifies me.

Yep, seems to be the case from what I found.

Like people with Citroen CXs, but far, far more complex, I expect

Richard

--
RichardK - 1980s in a can. http://www.dmc12.demon.co.uk/music/
Retro computing - http://www.dmc12.demon.co.uk/retrotech/
Cars - 2004 Beetle Cabrio, 1989 Supra 3.0i, 1990 Sera, 1989 Volvo 740
MidiGuitar, AU/X. Apple 77-04. See links. Email - upgrade to 128

In article <3ggcrqFbf0bcU1 (AT) individual (DOT) net>, RichardK says...
You just stated that you can do it easily with a car and trailer.




Applying for the provisional is free but you're looking at around £60-
£80 for the medical. When you apply for your provisional MAKE SURE YOU
TICK THE RIGHT CATEGORY as it lists C1+E, C1 and C in that order and
many people accidentally tick C1+E mistaking it for C+E.
Reckon on about £1000 for a 5 day course including test for Cat C and
about £800 for Cat C+E.




--
Conor


"Be incomprehensible. If they can't understand, they can't disagree"

In article <3ggd3lFcc3ntU1 (AT) individual (DOT) net>, RichardK says...


and having to do what was mentioned previously. The one thing it did do
was teach me to ask. :-) It really is a box that you need someone to
teach you how to use which is something you never have to do with a car
after lesson 1.



--
Conor


"Be incomprehensible. If they can't understand, they can't disagree"

Conor wrote:

Ah, see, I did two things when I first encountered a car blind. One, I
read, a lot, about how cars worked when I was a kid. The concept of a
drivetrain, of engine, brakes and suspension, was ingrained. I used to
read Haynes Manuals for fun. I also asked, when I was a kid, about how
to drive - I got to drive cars when I was 10, on very rare occasions.

And secondly, as soon as I had a car of my own to play with and space to
move it around in, when I was 16, I spent all my free time learning how
to reverse, turn, pull away smoothly, change gear, and use the mirrors
in my Allegro.

Of course I would ask how the gearbox works in a normal situation. I
genuinely don't believe that I would be as bad as the driver you
described after proper training. It's not ego speaking, it's just the
idea that with a lot of training, as required, most people with half a
brain shouldn't be that bad.

Still, I'm perfectly happy for you to bring an Eaton-equipped tractor
unit up and have a go in a suitably legal place. If I make a balls up of
in once I think I know how it works, you can laugh your head off at my
expense

Richard

--
RichardK - 1980s in a can. http://www.dmc12.demon.co.uk/music/
Retro computing - http://www.dmc12.demon.co.uk/retrotech/
Cars - 2004 Beetle Cabrio, 1989 Supra 3.0i, 1990 Sera, 1989 Volvo 740
MidiGuitar, AU/X. Apple 77-04. See links. Email - upgrade to 128

Conor wrote:

Erm, yes, which gives you the insight to either say I'm going to be
worse than a guy you showed as an example of terrible driving or to
sarcastically say they're incredible how?

Errr. I don't understand the way that follows on from what I said

Well, I'll apply for the provisional when I get my photo licence sorted
out then - I'll get the bike one renewed too if I have to, I forget what
happens with that. I have C1, I think, having passed my test in 1992.
Yeah. I have C1, C1+E. Hopefully my photo licence doesn't change that,
as it's supposed to expire in 2044 (as indeed the provisional bike
entitlement does).

Sorry, I mean't "To do what?", as in, what does passing it first time
prove? Is there some sort of competition now?

Yeah, definitely sounds like fun

Richard

--
RichardK - 1980s in a can. http://www.dmc12.demon.co.uk/music/
Retro computing - http://www.dmc12.demon.co.uk/retrotech/
Cars - 2004 Beetle Cabrio, 1989 Supra 3.0i, 1990 Sera, 1989 Volvo 740
MidiGuitar, AU/X. Apple 77-04. See links. Email - upgrade to 128

"RichardK" <atari (AT) NOSPAMbtconnect (DOT) com> wrote

It can't be that hard can it :-)

--
Dan

RichardK wrote:

Honestly, I don't know how I'd explain it to someone. I'm not sure I
could. (but it doesn't help that it's ~6 years since I drove one).

--
Ben Blaney

Conor wrote:

I can drive them pretty well. I trotted all over Europe in my ERF
Olympic [0] and loved every minute. I only ever used to miss a gear
when slowing from 90kph to stop at a tollbooth, because my
concentration would be broken by the thinking about my toll ticket,
money, expense book, which queue was shortest, which way to head after
the booth, etc.

But I really don't know if I could teach someone else to drive one.

[0] People hated them, because of the box and the big hump in the
middle of the cab. I loved mine, because I'd come from a Scania 113,
which was tiny inside.

--
Ben Blaney

DanTXD wrote:

It's possibly the most difficult thing I've learned to do in a
vehicle; never got round to having a bash at the reverse handbrake
turn. Given a wet road and an empty 7.5 tonne truck and can scare the
living shit out of anyone through a judicious use of a side-turning, a
pull on the air brake, and a spin of the wheel.

--
Ben Blaney

DanTXD wrote:
Well, I imagine it could be 'hard'. I imagine that the people who get
confused in a car but muddle along, the ones that learned 'monkey-see,
monkey-do' and use x lock for a corner, or worse, steer in a series of
straight lines to navigate a corner, would find it seriously challenging.

I imagine that acclimatising to the required engine speeds for changes,
the appropriate range for a given load and situation with a certain
power unit and so forth, takes a few minutes even for someone wholly
used to the gearbox.

And I imagine that whilst it's different, anyone with the time and
patience to learn, and the mechanical understanding to know what the
gearbox is doing, will probably be alright with it.

As I understand it, the Eaton Twin Split has Hi Split and Lo Split for
each ratio. I haven't found information to suggest if you would go "1
Lo, 1, 1 Hi" or use a combination of gears as you would overdrive on an
old TR6 (which could have o/d enaged on 2nd gear, but it was a horrid
thing to do to it), as my natural instinct is to think of it has a
3-range, 4 speed box with a low range and a high range set (I think it
might be that the direct drive is the lowest, then split 1 is higher,
then split 2 is 'top' ration for the transfer box after the conventional
3/4 speed box - I'm picturing two heavy duty gearboxes in series here,
one three/four speed, one three speed), so you would perhaps pull away
with a substantial load using 1, then 1 low, then 2, 3, 3 hi on A-roads
around here, and 4/4hi as speeds and conditions allowed. Since the
system is intended for clutchless changes when on the move, I don't know
if it's a case of slipping into neutral, matching engine speed and
moving the lever.

This is entirely based on assumptions about a device I haven't even
seen, so they're probably miles out and I freely admit to that - it's no
indication of the conclusions I'd reach once I'd actually seen the
gearbox/controls or found out more information.

I'm quite used to using the dual-range on the Subaru for towing and
dealing with slow traffic (the clutch on the Subaru is horrid in heavy
traffic, it's much nicer to use low-range 1st and just crawl, then when
speeds increase I'll usually go, 1low, 2low, 2, 3 4 5 etc.).

Richard

--
RichardK - 1980s in a can. http://www.dmc12.demon.co.uk/music/
Retro computing - http://www.dmc12.demon.co.uk/retrotech/
Cars - 2004 Beetle Cabrio, 1989 Supra 3.0i, 1990 Sera, 1989 Volvo 740
MidiGuitar, AU/X. Apple 77-04. See links. Email - upgrade to 128