"Mark" <mblackwell1958 (AT) yahoo (DOT) com> wrote

Which is one of the two reasons that the green/yellow combination is so
foolish. When they do start this way, and eventually go to green, the pole
driver does indeed get bonus points for having lead a lap - while under the
green/yellow. The second reason is that if the race does go green, those
pace laps count as race laps.

--

-Mike-
mmarlowREMOVE (AT) alltel (DOT) net

On Sun, 6 May 2007 11:53:30 -0400, "Mike Marlow" <mmarlow (AT) alltel (DOT) net>
wrote:

They should run under yellow till the track is dry, pit for gas, get
their positions back, then go green.

On May 5, 11:04 pm, Mark <mblackwell1... (AT) yahoo (DOT) com> wrote:

All you black helicopter people should start a newsgroup. Jeff led
the most laps on Sunday (SUNDAY), starting from Lap 1 (no pre-laps
from Saturday counted) and got his 10 bonus points. Why not wait to
see what happens instead of jumping right in with a wrong assumption?
Oh, right, that would be logical.

N.

"Nancy2" <nancy-dooley (AT) uiowa (DOT) edu> wrote

Black helicopter folks??? You need to read the above posts again. There is
no black helicopter stuff there. This weekend is not the first time that
NASCAR has started a race with the green and the yellow out and the pole
sitter does indeed get credit for laps lead under those situations. What
made this weekend different was that NASCAR stated that they would reset the
lap counter for Sunday. The original post was put up while Saturday's
green/yellow were flying. Sunday's race and any decisions relevant to the
start of Sunday's race were not even announced yet, and in fact had nothing
to do with the practice of starting under both the green and yellow. The
fact remains - despite decisions about Sunday's start, that many consider
the green/yellow to be a bogus way to start a race.

--

-Mike-
mmarlowREMOVE (AT) alltel (DOT) net

On May 8, 6:39 am, "Mike Marlow" <mmar... (AT) alltel (DOT) net> wrote:
It still would have been judicious to wait before posting. ("Better
to remain silent and be thought a fool than to speak out and remove
all doubt.") The BBs explained that if the race had ever gone to
green (without the yellow), the first-run laps would count. In this
case, the race never went to full green, so the laps didn't count.
I'm just sayin' ....

N.

"Nancy2" <nancy-dooley (AT) uiowa (DOT) edu> wrote


I think the gist of the entire thread (and certainly that of the original
poster) is that G/Y (*Y/G would be acceptable .... as the Y laps wouldn't
count .... and if they need the cars out there to help 'dry' the track, so
be it - but when it's ready, let them fuel the cars, get back in formation,
take the obligatory remaining pace laps, ... and then start under Green)
starts are utter garbage. First of all, ...... it is a donation of 5 pts. to
the pole sitter (for leading a lap at idle, i.e. in parade) *frankly,
earning that pole should be worth points anyways (i.e. in some cases they
spend 3 days doing it !!) .... but that's another debate**

......... and second of all, .... if the track isn't safe to start a race -
don't even bother moving the cars out there (in a lap counting mode !!).
Starting a race under caution is infinitely more nonsensical than finishing
one .............. and infinitely easier to avoid than finishing one (under
caution) - and they (NASCAR) have gone to great lengths to avoid the latter
(i.e. finishing under caution) - so there's nare an argument to be made FOR
starting under caution (iow, ... it's bogus

"Nancy2" <nancy-dooley (AT) uiowa (DOT) edu> wrote


You don't get it Nancy. It's not about whether the laps counted on Sunday
or not. It's about the foolishness of a green/yellow start. You seem not
to grasp that regardless of what happened Sunday, these have often resulted
in points awards under caution - before the race ever started.

--

-Mike-
mmarlowREMOVE (AT) alltel (DOT) net

I don't think anyone is disputing that part, Nanc..
I think the point is, and I agree with it, is that if
a race 'starts' under yellow, and say goes 15 laps,
and then gets the 'official green',
that the pole sitter gets credit for leading 15 laps,
on a race that no one was allowed to 'race'.
The 'race' never started...

So in a case like Gordon, who we all know often
doesn't need too much help leading races,
in theory, he could get the bonus for leading the most laps,
BECAUSE of the 'non-start'.... which really isn't fair
in my eyes....

not arguin'... just sayin'....



Dan
****************************************
I'm going to stop putting things off.
Starting tomorrow.

On May 8, 9:45 pm, "Mike Marlow" <mmar... (AT) alltel (DOT) net> wrote:

I don't think I argued about whether the green/yellow was foolish or
not; I merely stated I thought people should wait until there's a
resolution of a rain-out, before making assumptions and thus looking
foolish.

I've got no problem with saying green/yellow starts are silly.

N.

"Nancy2" <nancy-dooley (AT) uiowa (DOT) edu> wrote


Not sure how stating that the method of starting a race under two flags is
bogus makes anyone look foolish. Regardless of the rainout possibility,
that *is* how the race began on Saturday.

--

-Mike-
mmarlowREMOVE (AT) alltel (DOT) net