HANS Question

#11

TS02_05champ wrote:

Have no fear, I'm sure our resident expert will be by shortly to explain it.

:-)

[sounds like you've found what you needed]

#12

TS02_05champ wrote:

Quote:

Vandar wrote:

TS02_05champ wrote:

Chad wrote:

TS02_05champ wrote:

I noticed tonight that Tony Stewart put on his belts and then put his
HAS on *top* of the belts. Is there now a different way to secure the
HANS to the shoulders?

I haven't taken a great deal of notice if its under or over the
belts before, but can't imagine it makes any difference. The clipon
straps from the helmet to the back of the HANS is the only
connection I believe matters. The shape of it against the body is
what stops the head moving forward more than the spine, regardless
if its held agajnst the chest by belts or not.

What good is a HANS device that isn't held down by something?

You can't just sit the thing on your body / shoulders and expect it
to hold your head from snapping forward along *with* the device.

Even with the belts underneath it (which is an incorrect usage), the
only way your head and the device could snap forward is if your
shoulders went forward as well. With the harness pinning your
shoulders to the seat, you still shouldn't have an issue with the head
moving forward as long as the HANS is sitting on the shoulders.

Head inside helmet attached to HANS. HANS *sitting* on shoulders. Head
/ helmet moves forward. HANS that isn't secured with shoulder belts is
going to move forward / up. How could it not move if it isn't secured?

Because it wraps over the shoulders. If the shoulders can't move
(because of the belts), the HANS shouldn't move either.

Quote:

Yeah it may "work" w/o being secured *under* the belts, but then it's no
better than wearing a "donut".

I've often wondered why they can't just have the helmet straps attached
to the seat.

#13

SG wrote:

Quote:

TS02_05champ wrote:

Have no fear, I'm sure our resident expert will be by shortly to explain
it.

:-)

[sounds like you've found what you needed]

Now that I know how roof flaps work, I can't wait.....lol

#14

Vandar wrote:

Quote:

TS02_05champ wrote:

Vandar wrote:

TS02_05champ wrote:

Chad wrote:

TS02_05champ wrote:

I noticed tonight that Tony Stewart put on his belts and then put his
HAS on *top* of the belts. Is there now a different way to secure the
HANS to the shoulders?

I haven't taken a great deal of notice if its under or over the
belts before, but can't imagine it makes any difference. The clipon
straps from the helmet to the back of the HANS is the only
connection I believe matters. The shape of it against the body is
what stops the head moving forward more than the spine, regardless
if its held agajnst the chest by belts or not.

What good is a HANS device that isn't held down by something?

You can't just sit the thing on your body / shoulders and expect it
to hold your head from snapping forward along *with* the device.

Even with the belts underneath it (which is an incorrect usage), the
only way your head and the device could snap forward is if your
shoulders went forward as well. With the harness pinning your
shoulders to the seat, you still shouldn't have an issue with the
head moving forward as long as the HANS is sitting on the shoulders.

Head inside helmet attached to HANS. HANS *sitting* on shoulders.
Head / helmet moves forward. HANS that isn't secured with shoulder
belts is going to move forward / up. How could it not move if it isn't
secured?

Because it wraps over the shoulders. If the shoulders can't move
(because of the belts), the HANS shouldn't move either.

Then why is it supposed to be worn *under* the belts if it makes no
difference?

HANS even underlines "under the belts" as the proper usage. I also found
this.

<snip>

I can touch my chin to my chest with the device on. Is this a problem?

No. The HANS® tethers offer a great deal of mobility while still
reducing the chance of injury. In an actual impact, the HANS® will
remain stationary with respect to the shoulder belts, while your body
slides forward until the tethers straighten. (Your head will not swing
down towards your chest). The slack in the tethers is taken up before
the belts restrain the torso, the HANS®, and the head together.

#15

Vandar <vandar69 (AT) yahoo (DOT) com> wrote in
news:hbcv1v$lvl$2 (AT) news (DOT) albasani.net:

Quote:

TS02_05champ wrote:

Because it wraps over the shoulders. If the shoulders can't move
(because of the belts), the HANS shouldn't move either.

It doesn't wrap over the shoulders. It just sits on the top, and
down the front of the chest. There's no part of the HANS which
extends down the back.

Quote:

Yeah it may "work" w/o being secured *under* the belts, but then it's
no better than wearing a "donut".

I've often wondered why they can't just have the helmet straps
attached to the seat.

Because the driver's body is not attached to the seat. In a hard
impact, the belts can stretch enough for the driver's chest to
hit the steering wheel. The driver's neck won't stretch that far,
which it would have to do if the head & helmet were attached to
the seat.

John

#16

TS02_05champ <tonystewart02_05champ (AT) yahoo (DOT) com> wrote in
news:4ad9ee69$0$5635$9a6e19ea (AT) unlimited (DOT) newshosting.com:

Quote:

John McCoy wrote:
TS02_05champ <tonystewart02_05champ (AT) yahoo (DOT) com> wrote in
news:4ad97049$0 $5099$9a6e19ea (AT) unlimited (DOT) newshosting.com:

TS02_05champ wrote:
I noticed tonight that Tony Stewart put on his belts and then put
his HAS on *top* of the belts. Is there now a different way to
secure the HANS to the shoulders?
Never mind, this answers my question.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WsmOadX_njQ

Don't you wish you could get that sort of real, meaningful
information from the likes of Tim Brewer in the NASCAR
telecasts?

EuroSport is blowing ESPN and FOX away in quality.

John

Yeah, that would be nice. They always talk about safety, why not show
how the HANS works while they're at it? They talk about everything
else a million times.

Gotta admit, I didn't know they now made special belts with
pockets on the top for the HANS device. It makes sense, the
belts would be both more comfortable and tighter (better
restraint) if they didn't pass over the HANS.

John

#17

TS02_05champ wrote:

Quote:

Chad wrote:
TS02_05champ wrote:
Chad wrote:
TS02_05champ wrote:
I noticed tonight that Tony Stewart put on his belts and then put
his HAS on *top* of the belts. Is there now a different way to
secure the HANS to the shoulders?
I haven't taken a great deal of notice if its under or over the
belts before, but can't imagine it makes any difference. The
clipon straps from the helmet to the back of the HANS is the only
connection I believe matters. The shape of it against the body is
what stops the head moving forward more than the spine, regardless
if its held agajnst the chest by belts or not.
What good is a HANS device that isn't held down by something?

You can't just sit the thing on your body / shoulders and expect it
to hold your head from snapping forward along *with* the device.

Off cource the same forces that throw the head and body forward will
also act on the HANS itself. But the arms coming down the chest
working against the part around the back of the neck is what stops
the head moving forward faster than the spine, whether it is under
the belts or not.

I don't see how. It would lift up in the back and simply slide over
the shoulders.

I watched your vid and did a bit of googling and the reason it is so
important to have the HANS device under the belts is to prevent
sideways movement of the head during a crash

It doesnt need to be "held down" to prevent a basilar skull fracture
in a front on impact. (which is the primary reason stated for using
them)

Can you find a site that says the correct way to wear it is over the
belts?

Nope

--
Chad

#18

Vandar wrote:

Quote:

TS02_05champ wrote:

Vandar wrote:

TS02_05champ wrote:

Chad wrote:

TS02_05champ wrote:

I noticed tonight that Tony Stewart put on his belts and then
put his HAS on *top* of the belts. Is there now a different way
to secure the HANS to the shoulders?

I haven't taken a great deal of notice if its under or over the
belts before, but can't imagine it makes any difference. The
clipon straps from the helmet to the back of the HANS is the only
connection I believe matters. The shape of it against the body is
what stops the head moving forward more than the spine, regardless
if its held agajnst the chest by belts or not.

What good is a HANS device that isn't held down by something?

You can't just sit the thing on your body / shoulders and expect it
to hold your head from snapping forward along *with* the device.

Even with the belts underneath it (which is an incorrect usage), the
only way your head and the device could snap forward is if your
shoulders went forward as well. With the harness pinning your
shoulders to the seat, you still shouldn't have an issue with the
head moving forward as long as the HANS is sitting on the shoulders.

Head inside helmet attached to HANS. HANS *sitting* on shoulders. Head /
helmet moves forward. HANS that isn't secured with shoulder
belts is going to move forward / up. How could it not move if it
isn't secured?

Because it wraps over the shoulders. If the shoulders can't move
(because of the belts), the HANS shouldn't move either.

Yeah it may "work" w/o being secured *under* the belts, but then
it's no better than wearing a "donut".

I've often wondered why they can't just have the helmet straps
attached to the seat.

Actually there's a pretty detailed Wiki article on HANS that mentions that
is a bad idea. Because the body and belts will move a lot further forward
than the seat.

It also says that part of the reason to ensure the HANS is under the belts
is to ensure that there is equal force transmitted through the
body/belts/hans in a crash. Which kinda sorta supports what TS is arguing.
(but I still don't agree it *must* be strapped down or is useless)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HANS_device

--
Chad

#19

A. Jones wrote:

Quote:

On Sat, 17 Oct 2009 13:31:42 -0400, Vandar <vandar69 (AT) yahoo (DOT) com> wrote:

I've often wondered why they can't just have the helmet straps attached
to the seat.

My guess is it would be too simplistic and inexpensive.

My guess is, it wasn't designed to work that way...then again, I suppose
you are gonna claim to know more than the people at HANS.

#20

A. Jones wrote:

Quote:

On Sat, 17 Oct 2009 13:31:42 -0400, Vandar <vandar69 (AT) yahoo (DOT) com> wrote:

I've often wondered why they can't just have the helmet straps
attached to the seat.

My guess is it would be too simplistic and inexpensive.

That's gotta be just bait!