Mexico

#11

SimRacer wrote:

Quote:

I couldn't believe my ears when I heard Mike Joy state the Mexico City
population (which I think he said was 20 million, so 18, 20, close
enough). That is a pretty big reason indeed. Do they (N) race
anywhere else that large in population, in the US or otherwise?

1) Watkins Glen, in New York. I think that NYC hovers around 8 million.
2) Fontana, which is near Los Angeles. LA has about 12 million population.

--
_________________________________________
The bullshit stops when the hammer drops.
2nd Amendment - the original Homeland Security

#12

"SimRacer" <nOspaM@simracer68 (AT) yahoo (DOT) com> wrote

Quote:

I couldn't believe my ears when I heard Mike Joy state the Mexico City
population (which I think he said was 20 million, so 18, 20, close
enough).
That is a pretty big reason indeed. Do they (N) race anywhere else that
large in population, in the US or otherwise?

Second largest city in the world. Man, it just goes on forever from the
air. LA metro area is around 13 million.

Quote:

And to Weasel's point, it may not be that far off. Our lovely Prez seems
to
think that NAFTA and various other trade agreements in place with Mexico
are
necessary to "build a middle class" down there, and presumably stop the
flood of illegals that come here to do that very thing. Whatever. I don't
mind being the melting pot nation, just as long as the immigrants come
here
legally, get a SS number (and pay their taxes) and learn the language.
That's my one big stickler about Mexican immigrants to our area (NC has
had
a huge influx over the past decade), and that's their reluctance to even
attempt to learn English. Call me a racist if you must, but I don't think
it's our place to learn their language if they're going to live here among
us.

I have no qualms about NAFTA. If anything, it has made my business down

there a little bit easier as far as not having to get a work visa everytime
I go to a meeting. I still get one every now and then if there is an
extended project, and it is offshore.

Racism, as it is defined here doesn't really fit. Most folks in the US
think of Mexicans as brown skinned, black haired brown eyed people. In many
rural areas, that may well be the case, but most of the folks in Mexico that
I deal with are fair skinned. There is a fairly large middle class, and it
is growing, but the reforms there move very slowly. What hurts the country
the most, in my view, is a very poor transportation infrastructure.

As far as the Mexicans not learning English, most of them aren't here for
the long haul, but will work to send money home. The ones that do want to
participate do, in fact learn English. I, for one, am neither here nor
there on the issue.

Carey in Manvel

#13

"The Hammer" <HammerDrops (AT) bullshit (DOT) stops> wrote

Quote:

SimRacer wrote:
I couldn't believe my ears when I heard Mike Joy state the Mexico City
population (which I think he said was 20 million, so 18, 20, close
enough). That is a pretty big reason indeed. Do they (N) race
anywhere else that large in population, in the US or otherwise?

1) Watkins Glen, in New York. I think that NYC hovers around 8 million.
2) Fontana, which is near Los Angeles. LA has about 12 million
population.

--
_________________________________________
The bullshit stops when the hammer drops.
2nd Amendment - the original Homeland Security

Watkins Glen is over 250 miles from NYC. It's closer to Buffalo then NYC

#14

The Other Funk wrote:

Quote:

Watkins Glen is over 250 miles from NYC. It's closer to Buffalo then
NYC

It's only a 4 hour drive. Many of the folks that go to Watkins Glen are
from NYC. Last I checked, Buffalo had 147 humans and 3 snowmen.

--
_________________________________________
The bullshit stops when the hammer drops.
2nd Amendment - the original Homeland Security

#15

"SimRacer" <nOspaM@simracer68 (AT) yahoo (DOT) com> wrote in
news:EwnPf.56753$no3.39242 (AT) tornado (DOT) southeast.rr.com:

Quote:

I couldn't believe my ears when I heard Mike Joy state the Mexico City
population (which I think he said was 20 million, so 18, 20, close
enough). That is a pretty big reason indeed. Do they (N) race anywhere
else that large in population, in the US or otherwise?

Mexico City is the largest in North America, so no, they don't
race anywhere else even close to that large.

If you call Fontana part of LA (which is stretching it by an
awful lot) then they'd be getting in the range of 2/3rds of
Mexico City's population.

John

#16

"John McCoy" <igopogo (AT) ix (DOT) netcom.com> wrote

Quote:

"SimRacer" <nOspaM@simracer68 (AT) yahoo (DOT) com> wrote in
news:EwnPf.56753$no3.39242 (AT) tornado (DOT) southeast.rr.com:

I couldn't believe my ears when I heard Mike Joy state the
Mexico City
population (which I think he said was 20 million, so 18, 20,
close
enough). That is a pretty big reason indeed. Do they (N) race
anywhere
else that large in population, in the US or otherwise?

Mexico City is the largest in North America, so no, they don't
race anywhere else even close to that large.

If you call Fontana part of LA (which is stretching it by an
awful lot) then they'd be getting in the range of 2/3rds of
Mexico City's population.

John

Although, NY is close with 18million urban pop, just as Mexico
City is. Maybe why NASCAR is so adamant about building a track in
NY area.

Mexico *city* 8,548,639
urban 18,660,221
NY *city* 8,158,957
urban 18,252,339

http://www.mongabay.com/igapo/2005_world_city_populations/2005_urban_01.html
Stated as of 2003, I didn't bother to search for any more recent
numbers.

#17

"SimRacer" <nOspaM@simracer68 (AT) yahoo (DOT) com> wrote

Quote:

"Carey Akin" <cmakin (AT) att (DOT) net> wrote in
"WildWeasel" <wweasel_24 (AT) HooYah (DOT) com> wrote
--nascar thinks there (is) --- disposable income in Mexico
Believe it or not, and without the racist overtones, that is not too far
from the truth. What is the entire population of the state of Kentucky?
Mexico City alone has 18 million, plus. Big market there alone.
And to Weasel's point, it may not be that far off.

I also think that the NASCAR Busch race in Mexico City
makes good sense, for sports organization and for fans.
Decent two way trade and interaction.
Win - win.

Quote:

Our lovely Prez seems to think that NAFTA
and various other trade agreements in place with Mexico are
necessary to "build a middle class" down there, and presumably stop
the flood of illegals that come here to do that very thing. Whatever.

Ok, but being realistic, nothing will "stop" it, but improving
Mexico's economy will reduce the pressures and "slow" it.

Quote:

I don't mind being the melting pot nation, just as long as the
immigrants come here legally, get a SS number (and pay their
taxes) and learn the language. That's my one big stickler about
Mexican immigrants to our area (NC has had a huge influx over
the past decade), and that's their reluctance to even attempt to
learn English. Call me a racist if you must, but I don't think it's
our place to learn their language if they're going to live here

I will not call you anything unpleasant.
A number of your concerns have a valid base.
I'd just like to mention some current and historical trends.
Any time you have a large number of immigrants, there
are frictions (1600s, 1800s, 1900s, now.)
(English, Germans, Irish, Italians, Swedish, Norwegians etc.)
Language is certainly one point of friction.

Historically a fair number of the generation that moves,
are slow in changing their language (always has been).
The children (second generation) quite quickly in school
pick up the common language, and often speak both.
Traditionally the third generation has little ties with old.

Example 1, my grandmother came around 1900, never
became very good with English. My father did not speak
English until started first grade. I only know maybe ten
words from the 'old language'.
Example 2, my neighborhood grade school is now 1/3
"English Second Language". I've done some tutoring.
Native languages are real mix of Spanish, 'ex-USSR',
Vietnamese, Chinese etc. By HS graduation they are
quite intermixed. Some do excellent, some medium,
and some poorly.
Example 3, about 3 houses away, great success, 4 kids,
believe 3 have graduated college, all served military,
all doing well in helping contribute to their country, USA.

So IMHO we need to show some patience, understanding,
and some kindness. Almost all of us have immigrant roots.
The vitality of immigration has greatly helped the USA.

#18

"a425couple" <a425couple (AT) hotmail (DOT) com> wrote

Quote:

I also think that the NASCAR Busch race in Mexico City
makes good sense, for sports organization and for fans.
Decent two way trade and interaction.
Win - win.

Agreed. As it is in a lot of business.

Quote:

Ok, but being realistic, nothing will "stop" it, but improving
Mexico's economy will reduce the pressures and "slow" it.

Absolutely. Most of the folks I work with down in Mexico have good jobs,
and live well (and I am not talking about the expats, very prevelant in the
oil business). The certianly are not interested in emmigrating, since they
have what they want down there. And, in all honest, other than border towns
and Mexico City, I find that Mexico is a far safer place to live in that a
lot of places.

I also find that the young, educated Mexican professional, in his early to
mid 20's is an incredibly hard worker, as a whole. This generation growing
up seems, to me, anyway, to be far less tolerant of the corruption and
political favoritism that has held Mexico back for years.

Quote:

I will not call you anything unpleasant.
A number of your concerns have a valid base.
I'd just like to mention some current and historical trends.
Any time you have a large number of immigrants, there
are frictions (1600s, 1800s, 1900s, now.)
(English, Germans, Irish, Italians, Swedish, Norwegians etc.)
Language is certainly one point of friction.

Historically a fair number of the generation that moves,
are slow in changing their language (always has been).
The children (second generation) quite quickly in school
pick up the common language, and often speak both.
Traditionally the third generation has little ties with old.

Example 1, my grandmother came around 1900, never
became very good with English. My father did not speak
English until started first grade. I only know maybe ten
words from the 'old language'.
Example 2, my neighborhood grade school is now 1/3
"English Second Language". I've done some tutoring.
Native languages are real mix of Spanish, 'ex-USSR',
Vietnamese, Chinese etc. By HS graduation they are
quite intermixed. Some do excellent, some medium,
and some poorly.
Example 3, about 3 houses away, great success, 4 kids,
believe 3 have graduated college, all served military,
all doing well in helping contribute to their country, USA.

So IMHO we need to show some patience, understanding,
and some kindness. Almost all of us have immigrant roots.
The vitality of immigration has greatly helped the USA.

Agreed. That said, while illegal immigration (as I have stated earlier)

isn't one of my hot button issues, it certainly does need attention. Until
there is real enforcement of immigration laws as they apply to employers, we
will have this problem with us.

Carey in Manvel

#19

"Carey Akin" <cmakin (AT) att (DOT) net> wrote in message

Quote:

"a425couple" <a425couple (AT) hotmail (DOT) com> wrote in

Snip Most

Quote:

So IMHO we need to show some patience, understanding,
and some kindness. Almost all of us have immigrant roots.
The vitality of immigration has greatly helped the USA.

Agreed. That said, while illegal immigration (as I have stated earlier)
isn't one of my hot button issues, it certainly does need attention.
Until
there is real enforcement of immigration laws as they apply to employers,
we will have this problem with us. Carey in Manvel

Thank you for your kind words Carey.
I agree, it is not my "hottest" button issue, but needs work.
I fear many are losing perspective on it.
Nothing will totally stop all illegal immigration.
No past or future administration will have a "perfect answer".
Improvements are expensive, vexing, and need to be done
on many levels.

We (USA) are well served by having an ally, a good
functioning democracy with improving economy on our
southern border. Good trade and other interactions,
including motor sports, helps all.

#20

"a425couple" <a425couple (AT) hotmail (DOT) com> wrote

Quote:

..
Thank you for your kind words Carey.
I agree, it is not my "hottest" button issue, but needs work.
I fear many are losing perspective on it.
Nothing will totally stop all illegal immigration.
No past or future administration will have a "perfect answer".
Improvements are expensive, vexing, and need to be done
on many levels.

Yes, but enforcing the laws alread on the books where employers must verify
citizenship of their workers will go a long way. The company I work for
(British, but here in Houston) goes to great pains for our folks that come
to work here from all over the world; just as when we go to work in the UK
or elsewhere for extended periods. Why shouldn't contractors?

Quote:

We (USA) are well served by having an ally, a good
functioning democracy with improving economy on our
southern border. Good trade and other interactions,
including motor sports, helps all.

No argument from me. There is racing in Mexico, but just a little different

than up here. Most is open wheel on road courses, a more European type of
racing, as is much in Mexico. I don't know if it is still there, but a few
years back, there was a dirt oval in Ciudad Juarez. The WoO even ran a race
there.

I, for one, like the country, and have no qualms about walking around the
square of just about any city or town, late into the night. Families are
out, music playing (on the weekends), and truly friendly people. I look
forward to my trips down there, and will probably be back there this month
for a few days.

There is only one place I have ever been in the world where I had a gun
pulled on me (well, other than by police/military, but that is another
story) and that was right here in the Houston area, at a mall, at 2 in the
afternoon. Go figure.

Carey in Manvel

Quote: