Looking around online (autozone.com etc) I also see "round tooth" and
"square tooth" timing belts listed for my car. Do I have to get it off
to tell which of those I need? Or is there some other way?

Matt

You need the belt w/ the round tooth. The 89, 90 & 91 VG30E engines have
the square tooth. The 92, 93 & 94's have the round tooth. The first 3 years
recommend changing the timing belt every 60,000 mi. The later models
changed that to every 100,000 miles. If it hasn't been replaced and you
haven't hit 100,000, I'd still do it asap as the rubber has probably aged
and has deteriorated by now. Just check w/ the dealer when buying the timing
belt and they should get you the correct one.

Chris
90 & 94 GXE's

Good advise from everyone. So here is my list so far.

Timing Belt (Routh teeth, from the dealer)
Tensioner
Water Pump
Idler bearings
Cam and shaft seals (if they need it)
Thermostat
Coolant Temp Sensor
The cars other 3 belts

The car is at about 130k, and I changed the timing belt at about 60.
So, it's been 70k. But, what's prompting it more than the mileage is
the leaking water pump. Since it has to be replaced, and the t-belt is
due...might as well make an overhaul of it. Heck, I might as well
change the plugs, wires, and fuel filter while I'm at it. But I'll get
the first list done, and then make a second one.

I change the oil like clockwork, But I've only had the tranny serviced
once. I guess I should get that done too. Maybe after the new year.
Well, I could at least do a drain and fill, and then get it pumped
later on.

I'd really like to keep this car running for a long time. I'm going to
start on this stuff tomorrow night. This is by far the biggest car
project I've undertaken.

If anyone has any more tips or links, please pass them along.

Matt

Okay, so I went for it. I dug in yesterday and start taking things
apart.

After taking off the engine under covers, I realized I am missing a
right side engine cover, so I've added that to the list of things to
pick up from the dealer (or to order.)

I drained the coolant...took me a while to find the front engine block
plug. I never found the rear one. I suspect I'll have coolant leaking
out when I pull off the waterpump.

The belts came off ok once I got the adjusters free and moving.

Once I could see the crankshaft pulley, things got a bit more
difficult. I couln't figure out how to hold the pulley still while I
loostened the bolt. The Guy at the parts store told me to put the
breaker bar on, and crank the ignition a tiny bit. I'm SO not ready
for that. Eventually, I read my repair manual a bit more (duh) and it
suggested a chain wrench or strap wrench. I bought a cheap strap
wrench, which promply broke. After searching for hours, I found an
off-the-wall hardware store that carried a chain wrench. I used a
peice of the old belt to protect the pulley and the chain wrench worked
wonders!

Using the puller I borrowed from the parts store, I was able to easilly
get the pulley off.

After a few more pulleys, and a fillion screws, the t-belt covers
started coming off. I was able to get the bottom cover off as the top
cover is tough to remove. I think the water pump should come out next,
and then the top cover. Those are my next steps.

THE GOOD NEWS: After taking apart alll this stuff (and labeling it
all), I can finally see the waterpump. Sure enough! There is a
definate leak there in the pump. All my work is not wasted. The
t-belt looks really good. Of course I'll still replace it.

So, tomorrow, I'll take off the pump, and belt and see if I can find
the thermostat, seals etc.

Putting things back together seems like a doable task...the only two
things I'm afraid of are:

1) Getting the timing belt aligned properly.
2) Start it up for the first time after this is through! (Yikes!)

Onward,
matt

Make sure you've got the marks all lined up on the cam gears and crank
pulley. Go through it several times before tightening it up and putting the
covers back on. If all the marks are aligned, you'll be ok. Don't turn the
crank or cam gears separately and nothing will go out of time. Also, don't
feel the urge to crank down on the timing belt tensioner thinking "tighter
is better". You should be able to to twist the timing belt 90degrees with
your fingers. If you can't, then it's too tight. Did you mention that
you're replacing the timing belt tensioner?? I hope so!! If you haven't
done much work in this area before, it might be a good idea to use a torque
wrench so you don't over tighten anything. It's a bad habit that's easy to
get into. If you're a bull moose like me, it's easy to really crank on the
wrench not realizing that you are overtorqueing the bolts. This is not a
very hard job, it's just time consuming and tedious. Follow all the steps
in the manual and you'll do fine.

Chris
90 & 94 GXE's

"mdg" <gerter (AT) gmail (DOT) com> wrote

See if you can find one from a junkyard. It could be relatively pricey to
buy it new. I sure they will have to order it.


Huh? I didn't realize there was a rear one. I always did the stopcock on
the radiator and the front plug. That seemed to be enough. Maybe I've been
missing that one each time!


The good news is that if you do this again in 60-80K miles, the bolt will
come free much easier. One trick you can try is to remove the starter,
gently put a pry-bar into one of the teeth on the flywheel, and have someone
hold that bar while you turn the crank bolt. You shouldn't damage the
flywheel (it's VERY hard steel). I've been able to remove the crank bolt by
myself using this method (propped the prybar against the ground).


See, I told you to save up some swear words! The covers will both come off
before the pump, but it's a big pain in the arse.


Thermo housing, if I remember, is just above the pump. It may be behind the
upper timing belt cover.


Check your belt markings 4 or 5 times, and maybe have someone else look at
it to verify they are correct. Your manual may also tell you how many teeth
should be between the crank shaft marking and each of the two cam sprockets
(they'll be different numbers). You could count them as another way to
verify because it is possible to put the belt on backwards (although it will
still work, the notches will never line up to the belt markings).


Always scary, but if you've taken the time to make sure things are correct,
it should start right up. And THAT is a wonderful feeling.

Once you start it, check the engine for any leaks or unusual sounds. If it
sounds and looks OK, then sit and wait for it to reach proper temp. Don't
drive it until it does. Once my radiator fans kicked on, I knew everything
was OK. On my '91, the temp needle will point at the "P" in "TEMP" and
literally never move from there.

Good luck re-assembling (it goes faster than dis-assembly, but those
@#&^$#*@! t-belt covers still suck).

mdg wrote:


If you actually bought a dealer belt, it isn't a concern as the belt has
marks on it. If you cheaped out and didn't get a dealer belt, I'll bet you
end up doing this again next weekend! The marks on the covers aren't close
enough to accurately align the belt, most people end up with the rear cam
off 1 tooth using parts store belts. I've redone hundreds because of this..



--

Steve

http://www.atlantaracing.com

I need a new news reader. I'm just using google.com and I don't see an
option to quote messages. Makes it hard to respond to specific
comments. I'll get thunderbird setup today sometime so I can actually
reply in a worthwhile way.

Steve T: I did buy the belt from the dealer. In fact, I'm taking it
back today because they gave me the square tooth one, and I need the
round teeth one. I was buying so many parts, I forgot to check. My
old belt is still on, and I've aligned it as good as I cool. I've also
made a mark on the belt/gear. I'll mark the new belt the same, and
then line up the marks...counting the teeth inbetween all the points.
This should give me a few ways to check the alignment.

ChrisH: I checked the belt that's already on, and you're right...I can
twist it 90 degrees, and no more. I'll make sure the new belt is the
same. You're right...I am also replacing the tensioner.

Bill G: Good call on the junkyard to find the side engine cover. I've
spent enough(!) at the dealer and autoparts store. I'll get this
project done, and then look around for one of those. You were right
about the thermo housing. It was right there next to the water pump.
It came off pretty easilly, and I got the thermostat replaced.

So, last night after realizing I had the wrong belt, I went ahead and
did the water pump and the thermostat. By tonight, they'll have had 24
hours to cure. I should be able to put the rest of the parts back on
and get that baby running again.

I bought all three seals, but I'm hesitant to replace them. After I
get the tbelt off tonight, I'll look around and see if any oil is
leaking. If not, should I still replace them? Seems like getting the
tbelt aligned after taking off those sprokets would be more of a pain.
Any special tools needed to put those seals in?

Nearly done! Thanks for the continued support.

Matt

Sounds like you are taking your time and thinking things through. If you're
not sure, just ask someone.You'll get it!!

Chris

mdg wrote:

The new belt should already have marks on it..

--

Steve

http://www.atlantaracing.com