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Lifetime of Saab
Saab Saab Automobiles Discussions (alt.autos.saab)
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#31
 
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Re: Lifetime of Saab -
11-21-2006
, 12:38 PM
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In article <4561f5c9$0$2446$db0fefd9 (AT) news (DOT) zen.co.uk>, thedervman (AT) gmail (DOT) com says... By the same token my Dad bought a Fiat in '75 about two weeks after I was bought. Before Ebay banned the sale of organs, pets and children? |
I was wondering if anybody would spot that. Here it means "born" heh.
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The DervMan
www.dervman.com
#32
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in article 4561f5c9$0$2446$db0fefd9 (AT) news (DOT) zen.co.uk, DervMan at thedervman (AT) gmail (DOT) com wrote on 20/11/2006 18:16: "johannes" <johs (AT) siz-nospam-efitter (DOT) com> wrote in message news:4560BC6F.A3ED4AC7 (AT) siz-nospam-efitter (DOT) com... DervMan wrote: "john" <jsmith1456 (AT) yahoo (DOT) com> wrote in message news:yj08h.56259$r4.1932 (AT) newsfe3-gui (DOT) ntli.net... "Greg Farris" <farris (AT) nasa (DOT) org> wrote in message news:ejpt5n$8tc$1 (AT) biggoron (DOT) nerim.net... In article <1163823344.249474.46450 (AT) k70g2000cwa (DOT) googlegroups.com>, smaartaassaabr (AT) gmail (DOT) com says... What country, Finland, Sweden? When was it retired from the police? If it is in good shape then it is. The engines last forever. . . No they don't. SAAB engines are no different from other engines in the category, and are subject to the same wear and failure modes as their counterparts. If anything, the turbocharged models run at typically higher IMEP and specific output, and should thus be subject to greater wear. I believe the reason behind the SAAB reputation for longevity is the pride in ownership that leads many owners to take excellent care of them, and as well to boast of their achievements in long-lasting reliability. After all, the 96 generation already had a reputation for fantastic longevity, yet they had a demonstrably inferior body design, leading to massive rust problems, and their engine was nothing other than a Ford V4, the same as used in the Taurus models, which did not benefit from any particular cult reputation. The gearboxes were notoriously short-lived, a tradition SAAB has unhappily managed to perpetuate through the model-years! Well OK. volvo and saab were very solid long lasting vehicles in the 70's compared to most stuff. especially when the alternative was english or italian... If you bought one new you could expect 15 years of decent motoring....with a Fiat you'd be getting the filler out after 5.... Months in many cases. Dunno, FIAT also uses galvanised rust free bodies these days. We're discussing old ones, though, innit? Fiats may brake down from mechanical reasons, however. My Croma (1987) was quite durable for 10 years. But window frames rusted and a clutch repair seems impossible to get right, Possibly due to incompetent main dealership. (Competent servicing means a lot for durability). Interior plastics was crappy as it warped and rattled, speedo and odometer stopped working. By the same token my Dad bought a Fiat in '75 about two weeks after I was bought. Said it was a great engine, strange handling, but fell apart inside a couple of years. FIATs have come a long way since those dark days ... |
Some *cough Volkswagen cough* have not.
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Our '99 Punto Sporting just refuses to do anything wrong or show signs of failing. |
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True, it's getting on a little now but we've done nothing but normal maintenance and it's bailed us out a couple of times when the old SAAB has been a little reluctant  |
refusing to self correct, the rust that came up in the back and the tappets
failing. It was great fun...
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That said, our son has one of those MK2 Selespeed time bombs (you know, with the Ferrari paddles)  On the face of it, it seems okay, but it's goingto go horribly wrong one day ... |
--
The DervMan
www.dervman.com
#33
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"Elder" <carl.robson (AT) bouncing-czechs (DOT) com> wrote in message news:MPG.1fccf3a471aba62cc48 (AT) news (DOT) individual.net... In article <4561f5c9$0$2446$db0fefd9 (AT) news (DOT) zen.co.uk>, thedervman (AT) gmail (DOT) com says... By the same token my Dad bought a Fiat in '75 about two weeks after I was bought. Before Ebay banned the sale of organs, pets and children? I was wondering if anybody would spot that. Here it means "born" heh. |
You were bought around 9 months earlier. You came off the production
line 2 weeks before the Fiat was bought.
In your case your owners had to pre-order you, pay a deposit and then
keep paying the installments for anything like the next 20-25 years.
Had you been ordered in pink colour the installments could reappear
10-20 years after your owners thought they paid for you.
And on it goes ... bottom line I don't like the 9-3 (too small) and the
9-5 is too big. So what am I going to do after the 9000.
:-)
Charles
PS. Might as well contribute some complete and utter garbage to the
discussion too.
--
Please remove _removeme_ to reply.
#34
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DervMan wrote: "Elder" <carl.robson (AT) bouncing-czechs (DOT) com> wrote in message news:MPG.1fccf3a471aba62cc48 (AT) news (DOT) individual.net... In article <4561f5c9$0$2446$db0fefd9 (AT) news (DOT) zen.co.uk>, thedervman (AT) gmail (DOT) com says... By the same token my Dad bought a Fiat in '75 about two weeks after I was bought. Before Ebay banned the sale of organs, pets and children? I was wondering if anybody would spot that. Here it means "born" heh. Ahhh you don't know your cars do you? You were bought around 9 months earlier. You came off the production line 2 weeks before the Fiat was bought. In your case your owners had to pre-order you, pay a deposit and then keep paying the installments for anything like the next 20-25 years. Had you been ordered in pink colour the installments could reappear 10-20 years after your owners thought they paid for you. And on it goes ... bottom line I don't like the 9-3 (too small) and the 9-5 is too big. So what am I going to do after the 9000. |
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:-) Charles PS. Might as well contribute some complete and utter garbage to the discussion too. |
--
The DervMan
www.dervman.com
#35
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Did you have any facts to add to the discussion, or should I just expect you to come up with more errors like your claim about Saab making a model called the DKW... |
(slight chuckle) I admit my phrase was not well formulated. By "model" I meant
"example" - the thing they were emulating! I actually saw the ambiguity, but
out of laziness I decided to credit the reader with sufficient understanding -
but then - need I say more? I do apologize for the ambiguity.
Contrary to what you seem to think, I do not believe or profess to be any sort
of expert on Saab automobiles. If you read the thread I don't think you'll find
any assertion of the sort. In 1990, when I bought my 5th Saab, the company sent
me a book, "The First Forty Years," and I read it. I'm sure many others here
have as well. Not enough to make one an expert, but just enough to know that
DKW (and BMW, and Volvo) are not Saab automobiles!
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You're also apparently unaware that sometimes ones doesn't have to to "research" on a topic, if they already know about it. Do I have to "research" that a workable turbo went into production in 1977? (insert quibble about the word "production", go ahead if you must). |
Do I detect a short-term memory failure? I was only responding to your own
claim of "pretending" to do research! This was supposed to be so compelling as
to preclude any possible rejoinder on my behalf! (A usenet classic - I'll
have to remember that one!) For my part I have not done, or even pretended to
do any research in the context of this discussion.
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Wow. That was a really long sentence. You seem obsessed about this "forever" word. |
Well, that -IS- the topic of this discussion. It would appear I need to remind
you of your own argument. Your argument is in defense of the proposition that
Saab engines last "forever". I know it was not you who made that claim, and I
accept that the claim was made with some degree of hyperbole, but my objection
to it is the basis of your reaction, and if one is to credit you with the least
grain of sanity, it can only be that you believe this claim to be true.
So what did you think about the high mileage
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listings? |
I have an axe that's as old as me and will survive me. It has had three new
heads and four new handles . . . I have also owned six Saabs, and changed out
about that many engines and gearboxes. Those listings do not say anything
about that.
I do think it's interesting that many of the cars that have inspired the most
boastful claims for longevity and reliability are those that were developed
with no pretention other than to make the cheapest, most accessible
transportation. The French 2CV. The Volkswagen Beetle. The early Saabs. The
Mercedes, incontestably better engineered machines, do not have vociferous fan
clubs in the background, measuring mileage statistics!
GF
Yes, on a cosmic time scale, these cars don't last "forever",
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nobody has claimed otherwise. |
#36
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Did you have any facts to add to the discussion, or should I just expect you to come up with more errors like your claim about Saab making a model called the DKW... DKW was the manufacturer of 2 & 3 cylinder 2 stroke engine which saab up to and including the 96 model |
significantly throughout the years, and manufactured it.
#37
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"Elder" <carl.robson (AT) bouncing-czechs (DOT) com> wrote in message news:MPG.1fccf327b2752f63c47 (AT) news (DOT) individual.net... In article <ejqhdg$gr7$2 (AT) biggoron (DOT) nerim.net>, farris (AT) nasa (DOT) org says... Why should I not "lump everyone's design together" when that's exactly what GM (the manufacturer of SAAB) has been doing since 1994? Because this car does not belong in the post 94 GM world of one lump fits all. The later the Saab, the more generic - but that's not to say there are not still different and unique features in '94 onwards Saabs. Oh true. Very true. |
is a GM Saab, although I might be tempted by a late 9000 2.3 FPT.
--
Carl Robson
Audio stream: http://www.bouncing-czechs.com:8000/samtest
Homepage: http://www.bouncing-czechs.com
Now Playing at home:Switchblade Symphony-Gutter Glitter
#38
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And on it goes ... bottom line I don't like the 9-3 (too small) and the 9-5 is too big. So what am I going to do after the 9000. |
exterior dimensions have not changed greatly from the OG 9-3's, the
interior room is quite a bit better. The back seat is actually usable
by full size adults.
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-Fred W
#39
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Charles C. wrote: And on it goes ... bottom line I don't like the 9-3 (too small) and the 9-5 is too big. So what am I going to do after the 9000. Have you looked closely at the newer 9-3 Sport Sedans yet? While the exterior dimensions have not changed greatly from the OG 9-3's, the interior room is quite a bit better. The back seat is actually usable by full size adults. |
prices ... getting old to get underneath the car on a gravel drive).
When I am on the drivers seat you could only get a 10 year old behind
me. Simply getting in/out of the car, reaching the controls etc. the
9-5 is more agreeable with me. Then I would like it in estate form
(station wagon) but it could double up as an undertaker's car :-)
I also had on loan a 9-5 estate diesel (2.2L engine yikes) which did
nothing for me ... It was battleship gray outside and it was battleship
gray inside. How interesting :-(
Both cars made me appreciate the one I have. It is more fun, and if it
is a bit short on the leg position for the driver it feels more
vroom-vroom (if you know what i mean). Also if I go vroom-vroom I tend
to sit more upright (as in the C900s). The newer SAABs give me the
impression that the seat is lower (more like BMWs).
All said and done a 9-5 aero wheel spinning and sliding a bit might put
a smile on my face. The 9-3 I drove (also diesel 1.9 sport, and the 9-5
diesel) where a bad move from the dealer to give them to me as courtesy
cars.
For now I am staying with the 9000 for a while longer. It will soon
mark 100k miles.
:-)
Charles
--
Please remove _removeme_ to reply.
#40
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Both cars made me appreciate the one I have. It is more fun, and if it is a bit short on the leg position for the driver it feels more vroom-vroom (if you know what i mean). Also if I go vroom-vroom I tend to sit more upright (as in the C900s). The newer SAABs give me the impression that the seat is lower (more like BMWs). All said and done a 9-5 aero wheel spinning and sliding a bit might put a smile on my face. The 9-3 I drove (also diesel 1.9 sport, and the 9-5 diesel) where a bad move from the dealer to give them to me as courtesy cars. For now I am staying with the 9000 for a while longer. It will soon mark 100k miles. |
above the lowest position to keep my head off the headliner. Seeing as you
are under 100k, you got plenty of time to change driving styles before
making a real decision.
--
Stephen B.
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