am I wrong here?

#1

My 2003 VUE went in for inspection, with 50K miles on it. I 25,000
miles/year. I asked the manager to do his best to make sure I didn't see him
for the next 25K. I also told him the front brakes felt like the rotors were
warped, but only at turnpike speeds.
He called and said the rotors were very badly warped. I said, "replace
please."
He said the tires would pass but they were not going to get another 25K. I
said replace them.
He said the tranny fluid should be drained and replaced at 50K, with
Saturn's special fluid, for $100; I said, "do it."
He recommended the alignment, and I didn't argure.
Here's the bill:
State Inspection $ 81.05
Front Rotors $ 324.36
Front tires $ 271.70
Wheel Alignment $ 105.79
Transmission Fluid Replaced $ 98.44
Rear Wiper refill and nut cap $ 21.67
plus State tax: $54

So I get the nealry $1,000 bill and say, "you replace the front brake pads?"
He says, "because they had 5/32" left, and passed inspection".
So now the mechanics are going home for the day, I have just used up a
precious personal day to get all this done and won't have a chance to get
the car in again for months. And now, I'm pissed off.
So the same pads that have been getting beat up by badly warped rotors are
still in my car, even though I explicitly and repeatedly told them to
replace anything close to kaput. I never argured or questioned the money.
My conclusion is this: SATURN SERVICE IS OVERPRICED, AND NO ONE GIVES A CRAP
ABOUT WHAT'S IN THE CUSTOMER'S BEST INTEREST.

I'm guessing George Costanza was right, "take my car to a dealer? why don't
I just flush my money down the toilet!"
Scout

#2

So I get the nearly $1,000 bill and say, "did you replace the front brake
pads?"
He says, "no ,because they had 5/32" left, and passed inspection".

#3

Ummm...Yes George was right.

If you can't/won't/don't want to do the repairs yourself,
find a good local independent guy and get him to do it. He will find good
aftermarket parts, much cheaper than OEM, and his labour rate will probably
be 20% lower at least.

Just my $0.02 worth.

R.

"Scout" <scoutsails (AT) hotmail (DOT) com> wrote

Quote:

My 2003 VUE went in for inspection, with 50K miles on it. I 25,000
miles/year. I asked the manager to do his best to make sure I didn't see
him
for the next 25K. I also told him the front brakes felt like the rotors
were
warped, but only at turnpike speeds.
He called and said the rotors were very badly warped. I said, "replace
please."
He said the tires would pass but they were not going to get another 25K. I
said replace them.
He said the tranny fluid should be drained and replaced at 50K, with
Saturn's special fluid, for $100; I said, "do it."
He recommended the alignment, and I didn't argure.
Here's the bill:
State Inspection $ 81.05
Front Rotors $ 324.36
Front tires $ 271.70
Wheel Alignment $ 105.79
Transmission Fluid Replaced $ 98.44
Rear Wiper refill and nut cap $ 21.67
plus State tax: $54

So I get the nealry $1,000 bill and say, "you replace the front brake
pads?"
He says, "because they had 5/32" left, and passed inspection".
So now the mechanics are going home for the day, I have just used up a
precious personal day to get all this done and won't have a chance to get
the car in again for months. And now, I'm pissed off.
So the same pads that have been getting beat up by badly warped rotors are
still in my car, even though I explicitly and repeatedly told them to
replace anything close to kaput. I never argured or questioned the money.
My conclusion is this: SATURN SERVICE IS OVERPRICED, AND NO ONE GIVES A
CRAP
ABOUT WHAT'S IN THE CUSTOMER'S BEST INTEREST.

I'm guessing George Costanza was right, "take my car to a dealer? why
don't
I just flush my money down the toilet!"
Scout

#4

Sorry about your experience. It (the hassle) would have probably been
lessened if your schedule wasn't so tight. I have to use personal time too
to get errands done and it's a bummer when something goes wrong. I'm in a
large city and nothing is too far, it's just the time I'm always short of.

And I used to do the same thing; get whatever the car needed and just pay
the price. Honestly I think the service at my Saturn dealer was better than
today. Today they seem a little leaner in their efforts - still nice folks,
but nothing that says they're going 110%. Maybe it's just perception on my
part.

Since labor rates are about the same at the dealer and at a private shop,
parts can be an area for savings. I did experiment with some aftermarket
parts on my 97 SL2 with some good results. When I just now looked at some
sport rotors for your Vue, they were only $219 pair - and about half that
price for vanilla rotors from something like carparts.com.

It was my experience if I just told the dealer "Ok" it felt like they didn't
think I knew anything, and my visit there was just adding to their revenue
stream. So I had to shift from passive mode to assertive mode and put in my
two cents. I didn't have to argue, I just had to get involved (exactly the
opposite of what I initially expected or wanted to do - now I sorta like
it). I also took in parts purchased elsewhere and had them installed when I
didn't want the OEM. It wasn't uncommon for me to have 4 new tires I bought
from tirerack.com in the back seat, and then drive to the dealer for
installation.

Personally I always do pad/rotors together and I have warped my fair share.
I don't care how much pad is left, they're cheap and I liked to try new or
different formulations too. Typically you can swap or turn rotors and use
the old pads, or get new pads and not turn or swap the rotors.

Sorry for the long thread - basically no service type experience (from car
repairs to vacation cruises) will get it right, the first time, all the time
and every time. And all of them require specific input from the customer if
you want specific results. You may even have to ask they repeat back to you
what they think they heard you say or request. And if your radar goes up,
start asking questions.

"Scout" <scoutsails (AT) hotmail (DOT) com> wrote

Quote:

My 2003 VUE went in for inspection, with 50K miles on it. I 25,000
miles/year. I asked the manager to do his best to make sure I didn't see
him
for the next 25K. I also told him the front brakes felt like the rotors
were
warped, but only at turnpike speeds.
He called and said the rotors were very badly warped. I said, "replace
please."
He said the tires would pass but they were not going to get another 25K. I
said replace them.
He said the tranny fluid should be drained and replaced at 50K, with
Saturn's special fluid, for $100; I said, "do it."
He recommended the alignment, and I didn't argure.
Here's the bill:
State Inspection $ 81.05
Front Rotors $ 324.36
Front tires $ 271.70
Wheel Alignment $ 105.79
Transmission Fluid Replaced $ 98.44
Rear Wiper refill and nut cap $ 21.67
plus State tax: $54

So I get the nealry $1,000 bill and say, "you replace the front brake
pads?"
He says, "because they had 5/32" left, and passed inspection".
So now the mechanics are going home for the day, I have just used up a
precious personal day to get all this done and won't have a chance to get
the car in again for months. And now, I'm pissed off.
So the same pads that have been getting beat up by badly warped rotors are
still in my car, even though I explicitly and repeatedly told them to
replace anything close to kaput. I never argured or questioned the money.
My conclusion is this: SATURN SERVICE IS OVERPRICED, AND NO ONE GIVES A
CRAP
ABOUT WHAT'S IN THE CUSTOMER'S BEST INTEREST.

I'm guessing George Costanza was right, "take my car to a dealer? why
don't
I just flush my money down the toilet!"
Scout

#5

Thanks for your input. All good points. I guess it's a learning experience.
I've done my own brakes and rotors in the past, but my situation these days
doesn't lend itself well to tearing my car apart. I put both rotors and pads
on my 97 SL2 for $155 (my labor). When he quoted me $324, I figured pads
were an automatic. I paid $75 for both rotors 2 years ago, and even if I
figure their cost at $100, that still leaves $224 for about an hours worth
of labor.
Ah well, I hope they spend the $$ well, it's the last they'll get from me.
Scout

"Jonnie Santos" <jonniesantos (AT) hotmail (DOT) com> wrote

Quote:

Sorry about your experience. It (the hassle) would have probably been
lessened if your schedule wasn't so tight. I have to use personal time
too to get errands done and it's a bummer when something goes wrong. I'm
in a large city and nothing is too far, it's just the time I'm always
short of.

And I used to do the same thing; get whatever the car needed and just pay
the price. Honestly I think the service at my Saturn dealer was better
than today. Today they seem a little leaner in their efforts - still nice
folks, but nothing that says they're going 110%. Maybe it's just
perception on my part.

Since labor rates are about the same at the dealer and at a private shop,
parts can be an area for savings. I did experiment with some aftermarket
parts on my 97 SL2 with some good results. When I just now looked at some
sport rotors for your Vue, they were only $219 pair - and about half that
price for vanilla rotors from something like carparts.com.

It was my experience if I just told the dealer "Ok" it felt like they
didn't think I knew anything, and my visit there was just adding to their
revenue stream. So I had to shift from passive mode to assertive mode and
put in my two cents. I didn't have to argue, I just had to get involved
(exactly the opposite of what I initially expected or wanted to do - now I
sorta like it). I also took in parts purchased elsewhere and had them
installed when I didn't want the OEM. It wasn't uncommon for me to have 4
new tires I bought from tirerack.com in the back seat, and then drive to
the dealer for installation.

Personally I always do pad/rotors together and I have warped my fair
share. I don't care how much pad is left, they're cheap and I liked to try
new or different formulations too. Typically you can swap or turn rotors
and use the old pads, or get new pads and not turn or swap the rotors.

Sorry for the long thread - basically no service type experience (from car
repairs to vacation cruises) will get it right, the first time, all the
time and every time. And all of them require specific input from the
customer if you want specific results. You may even have to ask they
repeat back to you what they think they heard you say or request. And if
your radar goes up, start asking questions.

"Scout" <scoutsails (AT) hotmail (DOT) com> wrote in message
news:uXa5d.429148$OB3.238419 (AT) bgtnsc05-news (DOT) ops.worldnet.att.net...
My 2003 VUE went in for inspection, with 50K miles on it. I 25,000
miles/year. I asked the manager to do his best to make sure I didn't see
him
for the next 25K. I also told him the front brakes felt like the rotors
were
warped, but only at turnpike speeds.
He called and said the rotors were very badly warped. I said, "replace
please."
He said the tires would pass but they were not going to get another 25K.
I
said replace them.
He said the tranny fluid should be drained and replaced at 50K, with
Saturn's special fluid, for $100; I said, "do it."
He recommended the alignment, and I didn't argure.
Here's the bill:
State Inspection $ 81.05
Front Rotors $ 324.36
Front tires $ 271.70
Wheel Alignment $ 105.79
Transmission Fluid Replaced $ 98.44
Rear Wiper refill and nut cap $ 21.67
plus State tax: $54

So I get the nealry $1,000 bill and say, "you replace the front brake
pads?"
He says, "because they had 5/32" left, and passed inspection".
So now the mechanics are going home for the day, I have just used up a
precious personal day to get all this done and won't have a chance to get
the car in again for months. And now, I'm pissed off.
So the same pads that have been getting beat up by badly warped rotors
are
still in my car, even though I explicitly and repeatedly told them to
replace anything close to kaput. I never argured or questioned the money.
My conclusion is this: SATURN SERVICE IS OVERPRICED, AND NO ONE GIVES A
CRAP
ABOUT WHAT'S IN THE CUSTOMER'S BEST INTEREST.

I'm guessing George Costanza was right, "take my car to a dealer? why
don't
I just flush my money down the toilet!"
Scout

#6

You're 2003 Vue (A SUV) is not going to have the same rotors as your 97
SL2 (A small car). OEM rotors for a Vue are around a $150 bucks EACH.
Saturn dealers do not buy aftermarket rotors. Pads should have been
replaced with rotors yes. Why in the world would they think that is an
acceptable practise is beyond me. Improper wear on brake pads means
improper wear on a new rotors.
You can buy aftermarket rotors for $20-$25 bucks each and American made
semi-metalic brake pads for about $30 from Wearever. Anymore OEM rotors
arent worth the hassle. Just buy china made ones and pitch them when you
need new brakes again. Dealerships have to much overhead to price things
fairly anymore. Middle men are the ones killing this country IMO. They
want to get rich selling parts, not making parts. I know OEM brake pads
from Delphi are sold at 4 dollars a pair to GM. Where they get the $80
dollar price tag from stupefies me...

In article <iqh5d.430822$OB3.146099 (AT) bgtnsc05-news (DOT) ops.worldnet.att.net>,
scoutsails (AT) hotmail (DOT) com says...

Quote:

Thanks for your input. All good points. I guess it's a learning experience.
I've done my own brakes and rotors in the past, but my situation these days
doesn't lend itself well to tearing my car apart. I put both rotors and pads
on my 97 SL2 for $155 (my labor). When he quoted me $324, I figured pads
were an automatic. I paid $75 for both rotors 2 years ago, and even if I
figure their cost at $100, that still leaves $224 for about an hours worth
of labor.
Ah well, I hope they spend the $$ well, it's the last they'll get from me.
Scout

"Jonnie Santos" <jonniesantos (AT) hotmail (DOT) com> wrote in message
news:L%g5d.297318$Lj.279128 (AT) fed1read03 (DOT) ..
Sorry about your experience. It (the hassle) would have probably been
lessened if your schedule wasn't so tight. I have to use personal time
too to get errands done and it's a bummer when something goes wrong. I'm
in a large city and nothing is too far, it's just the time I'm always
short of.

And I used to do the same thing; get whatever the car needed and just pay
the price. Honestly I think the service at my Saturn dealer was better
than today. Today they seem a little leaner in their efforts - still nice
folks, but nothing that says they're going 110%. Maybe it's just
perception on my part.

Since labor rates are about the same at the dealer and at a private shop,
parts can be an area for savings. I did experiment with some aftermarket
parts on my 97 SL2 with some good results. When I just now looked at some
sport rotors for your Vue, they were only $219 pair - and about half that
price for vanilla rotors from something like carparts.com.

It was my experience if I just told the dealer "Ok" it felt like they
didn't think I knew anything, and my visit there was just adding to their
revenue stream. So I had to shift from passive mode to assertive mode and
put in my two cents. I didn't have to argue, I just had to get involved
(exactly the opposite of what I initially expected or wanted to do - now I
sorta like it). I also took in parts purchased elsewhere and had them
installed when I didn't want the OEM. It wasn't uncommon for me to have 4
new tires I bought from tirerack.com in the back seat, and then drive to
the dealer for installation.

Personally I always do pad/rotors together and I have warped my fair
share. I don't care how much pad is left, they're cheap and I liked to try
new or different formulations too. Typically you can swap or turn rotors
and use the old pads, or get new pads and not turn or swap the rotors.

Sorry for the long thread - basically no service type experience (from car
repairs to vacation cruises) will get it right, the first time, all the
time and every time. And all of them require specific input from the
customer if you want specific results. You may even have to ask they

#7

....yes, I priced them (front rotors) for his VUE. $219 a PAIR for the
Stillen's and $100 a PAIR for the Bendix.

"Blah Blah" <bl@h.blah> wrote

Quote:

You're 2003 Vue (A SUV) is not going to have the same rotors as your 97
SL2 (A small car). OEM rotors for a Vue are around a $150 bucks EACH.
Saturn dealers do not buy aftermarket rotors. Pads should have been
replaced with rotors yes. Why in the world would they think that is an
acceptable practise is beyond me. Improper wear on brake pads means
improper wear on a new rotors.
You can buy aftermarket rotors for $20-$25 bucks each and American made
semi-metalic brake pads for about $30 from Wearever. Anymore OEM rotors
arent worth the hassle. Just buy china made ones and pitch them when you
need new brakes again. Dealerships have to much overhead to price things
fairly anymore. Middle men are the ones killing this country IMO. They
want to get rich selling parts, not making parts. I know OEM brake pads
from Delphi are sold at 4 dollars a pair to GM. Where they get the $80
dollar price tag from stupefies me...

In article <iqh5d.430822$OB3.146099 (AT) bgtnsc05-news (DOT) ops.worldnet.att.net>,
scoutsails (AT) hotmail (DOT) com says...
Thanks for your input. All good points. I guess it's a learning
experience.
I've done my own brakes and rotors in the past, but my situation these
days
doesn't lend itself well to tearing my car apart. I put both rotors and
pads
on my 97 SL2 for $155 (my labor). When he quoted me $324, I figured pads
were an automatic. I paid $75 for both rotors 2 years ago, and even if I
figure their cost at $100, that still leaves $224 for about an hours
worth
of labor.
Ah well, I hope they spend the $$ well, it's the last they'll get from
me.
Scout

"Jonnie Santos" <jonniesantos (AT) hotmail (DOT) com> wrote in message
news:L%g5d.297318$Lj.279128 (AT) fed1read03 (DOT) ..
Sorry about your experience. It (the hassle) would have probably been
lessened if your schedule wasn't so tight. I have to use personal time
too to get errands done and it's a bummer when something goes wrong.
I'm
in a large city and nothing is too far, it's just the time I'm always
short of.

And I used to do the same thing; get whatever the car needed and just
pay
the price. Honestly I think the service at my Saturn dealer was better
than today. Today they seem a little leaner in their efforts - still
nice
folks, but nothing that says they're going 110%. Maybe it's just
perception on my part.

Since labor rates are about the same at the dealer and at a private
shop,
parts can be an area for savings. I did experiment with some
aftermarket
parts on my 97 SL2 with some good results. When I just now looked at
some
sport rotors for your Vue, they were only $219 pair - and about half
that
price for vanilla rotors from something like carparts.com.

It was my experience if I just told the dealer "Ok" it felt like they
didn't think I knew anything, and my visit there was just adding to
their
revenue stream. So I had to shift from passive mode to assertive mode
and
put in my two cents. I didn't have to argue, I just had to get
involved
(exactly the opposite of what I initially expected or wanted to do -
now I
sorta like it). I also took in parts purchased elsewhere and had them
installed when I didn't want the OEM. It wasn't uncommon for me to
have 4
new tires I bought from tirerack.com in the back seat, and then drive
to
the dealer for installation.

Personally I always do pad/rotors together and I have warped my fair
share. I don't care how much pad is left, they're cheap and I liked to
try
new or different formulations too. Typically you can swap or turn
rotors
and use the old pads, or get new pads and not turn or swap the rotors.

Sorry for the long thread - basically no service type experience (from
car
repairs to vacation cruises) will get it right, the first time, all the
time and every time. And all of them require specific input from the
customer if you want specific results. You may even have to ask they

#8

wow, that's an eye opener (parts prices).~

"Blah Blah" <bl@h.blah> wrote

Quote:

You're 2003 Vue (A SUV) is not going to have the same rotors as your 97
SL2 (A small car). OEM rotors for a Vue are around a $150 bucks EACH.
Saturn dealers do not buy aftermarket rotors. Pads should have been
replaced with rotors yes. Why in the world would they think that is an
acceptable practise is beyond me. Improper wear on brake pads means
improper wear on a new rotors.
You can buy aftermarket rotors for $20-$25 bucks each and American made
semi-metalic brake pads for about $30 from Wearever. Anymore OEM rotors
arent worth the hassle. Just buy china made ones and pitch them when you
need new brakes again. Dealerships have to much overhead to price things
fairly anymore. Middle men are the ones killing this country IMO. They
want to get rich selling parts, not making parts. I know OEM brake pads
from Delphi are sold at 4 dollars a pair to GM. Where they get the $80
dollar price tag from stupefies me...

In article <iqh5d.430822$OB3.146099 (AT) bgtnsc05-news (DOT) ops.worldnet.att.net>,
scoutsails (AT) hotmail (DOT) com says...
Thanks for your input. All good points. I guess it's a learning
experience.
I've done my own brakes and rotors in the past, but my situation these
days
doesn't lend itself well to tearing my car apart. I put both rotors and
pads
on my 97 SL2 for $155 (my labor). When he quoted me $324, I figured pads
were an automatic. I paid $75 for both rotors 2 years ago, and even if I
figure their cost at $100, that still leaves $224 for about an hours
worth
of labor.
Ah well, I hope they spend the $$ well, it's the last they'll get from
me.
Scout

"Jonnie Santos" <jonniesantos (AT) hotmail (DOT) com> wrote in message
news:L%g5d.297318$Lj.279128 (AT) fed1read03 (DOT) ..
Sorry about your experience. It (the hassle) would have probably been
lessened if your schedule wasn't so tight. I have to use personal time
too to get errands done and it's a bummer when something goes wrong.
I'm
in a large city and nothing is too far, it's just the time I'm always
short of.

And I used to do the same thing; get whatever the car needed and just
pay
the price. Honestly I think the service at my Saturn dealer was better
than today. Today they seem a little leaner in their efforts - still
nice
folks, but nothing that says they're going 110%. Maybe it's just
perception on my part.

Since labor rates are about the same at the dealer and at a private
shop,
parts can be an area for savings. I did experiment with some
aftermarket
parts on my 97 SL2 with some good results. When I just now looked at
some
sport rotors for your Vue, they were only $219 pair - and about half
that
price for vanilla rotors from something like carparts.com.

It was my experience if I just told the dealer "Ok" it felt like they
didn't think I knew anything, and my visit there was just adding to
their
revenue stream. So I had to shift from passive mode to assertive mode
and
put in my two cents. I didn't have to argue, I just had to get
involved
(exactly the opposite of what I initially expected or wanted to do -
now I
sorta like it). I also took in parts purchased elsewhere and had them
installed when I didn't want the OEM. It wasn't uncommon for me to
have 4
new tires I bought from tirerack.com in the back seat, and then drive
to
the dealer for installation.

Personally I always do pad/rotors together and I have warped my fair
share. I don't care how much pad is left, they're cheap and I liked to
try
new or different formulations too. Typically you can swap or turn
rotors
and use the old pads, or get new pads and not turn or swap the rotors.

Sorry for the long thread - basically no service type experience (from
car
repairs to vacation cruises) will get it right, the first time, all the
time and every time. And all of them require specific input from the
customer if you want specific results. You may even have to ask they

#9

No since in spending so much on a wear item. Check rockauto.com
I cant find anyone else with Vue brakes yet.

In article <2hp5d.297463$Lj.228997@fed1read03>, jonniesantos (AT) hotmail (DOT) com
says...

Quote:

...yes, I priced them (front rotors) for his VUE. $219 a PAIR for the
Stillen's and $100 a PAIR for the Bendix.

"Blah Blah" <bl@h.blah> wrote in message
news:MPG.1bbfd10ece5aff0d98986b (AT) news-server (DOT) woh.rr.com...
You're 2003 Vue (A SUV) is not going to have the same rotors as your 97
SL2 (A small car). OEM rotors for a Vue are around a $150 bucks EACH.
Saturn dealers do not buy aftermarket rotors. Pads should have been
replaced with rotors yes. Why in the world would they think that is an
acceptable practise is beyond me. Improper wear on brake pads means
improper wear on a new rotors.
You can buy aftermarket rotors for $20-$25 bucks each and American made
semi-metalic brake pads for about $30 from Wearever. Anymore OEM rotors
arent worth the hassle. Just buy china made ones and pitch them when you
need new brakes again. Dealerships have to much overhead to price things
fairly anymore. Middle men are the ones killing this country IMO. They
want to get rich selling parts, not making parts. I know OEM brake pads
from Delphi are sold at 4 dollars a pair to GM. Where they get the $80
dollar price tag from stupefies me...

#10

I had some luck at www.spswebpage.com (for the Stillen's) and
www.carparts.com (for the vanilla brands - about 3 if I remember).

I keep meaning to stop by the dealer and look under the hood of the V6 -
just curious to see the Honda engine.

"Blah Blah" <bl@h.blah> wrote

Quote:

No since in spending so much on a wear item. Check rockauto.com
I cant find anyone else with Vue brakes yet.

In article <2hp5d.297463$Lj.228997@fed1read03>, jonniesantos (AT) hotmail (DOT) com
says...
...yes, I priced them (front rotors) for his VUE. $219 a PAIR for the
Stillen's and $100 a PAIR for the Bendix.

"Blah Blah" <bl@h.blah> wrote in message
news:MPG.1bbfd10ece5aff0d98986b (AT) news-server (DOT) woh.rr.com...
You're 2003 Vue (A SUV) is not going to have the same rotors as your 97
SL2 (A small car). OEM rotors for a Vue are around a $150 bucks EACH.
Saturn dealers do not buy aftermarket rotors. Pads should have been
replaced with rotors yes. Why in the world would they think that is an
acceptable practise is beyond me. Improper wear on brake pads means
improper wear on a new rotors.
You can buy aftermarket rotors for $20-$25 bucks each and American made
semi-metalic brake pads for about $30 from Wearever. Anymore OEM rotors
arent worth the hassle. Just buy china made ones and pitch them when
you
need new brakes again. Dealerships have to much overhead to price
things
fairly anymore. Middle men are the ones killing this country IMO. They
want to get rich selling parts, not making parts. I know OEM brake pads
from Delphi are sold at 4 dollars a pair to GM. Where they get the $80
dollar price tag from stupefies me...